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A couple of new insights that may help!
  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    After a long dry period, I came back and got some new insights that helped me with, I think, the correct approach during a session.
    I don't know if what I'm going to write now is what they call around here to be "rewired" or not, but here it goes.


    There are two major approaches when dealing with sexual acts. You're either on the active, male, dominating side, or on the passive, female, submissive side. Each side is a whole world on its own, so when incarnating the male approach, you'll do what you're used to do, but when incarnating the female approach, you'll have to do things in a very different way. The male gives, the female recieves. What will the male give if it has nothing to give? What will the female recieve if she's already full?

    To be able to recieve, first you must empty yourself. You can't fill a cup that's already full. So your approach during a session will be one of creating space within yourself, and not only that, you also will pay a lot of attention to what's going on, as to not "invade" (remember that male "invades", it penetrates, it tries to make a change, while female recieves, it never invades).

    You will HAVE to deal with escalating pleasure in a relaxed way. Remember, you're creating space within yourself to be able to recieve, eventually to turn into a "vaccuum of pleasure", or the super-o.

    When starting a traditional sexual act, you must start slow most of the time, or else you won't be able to handle the sensations and ejaculate beforehand. To put it in the words of what I just said, if the female takes on a male approach (to "invade"), she can make the male ejaculate in a second, that is, if she contracts her vagina, or moves too much, she'll make you cum. To contract is to invade, to relax is the opposite.
    So while the male "invasive" side participates making a change, the female side participates paying attention to the changes the male is doing.

    To be able to recieve tons of pleasure then, you must take on the female approach. Your primary mode will be a non invasive, passive expansive mode, which means, when not feeling anything, instead of taking the male approach, which is to thrust or apply more pressure so that you can regain sensation, you'll take the female approach which is one of relaxing, expanding, sensing, to be able to "track" pleasure and then keep on flowing.

    Now, this is the part where I think what to be "rewired" means, correct me if I'm wrong, though. As men, we tend to deal with pleasure in an invasive way, we don't let pleasure be, we tend to contract our bodies as soon as things get good, breath shortens, or we tend to hold it in, we tense our leg muscles, but most importantly, we create internal pressure. If we carry on with the same approach, eventually pleasure won't have any other place to go but the tip of your penis and be expelled through it.
    When taking the passive approach, we encounter many different new sensations, when pleasure moves through parts where it was never allowed moved before the sensations might be too much to handle. We are not used to these sensations, we're used to supress them and force them their quickest way out. You must deal with these sensations in a relaxed state.
    Not only with relaxed muscles, but very importantly, also with no internal pressure! When things start getting good you'll tend to create internal pressure, tense up your stomach, your sphincters, etc. You must deal with the aneros during a session without internal pressure. It's hard, you're used to doing exactly the opposite your whole life. I'd define this as an "acquired taste" (=to be rewired?). When taking the female approach this feels like an eternal drum roll. When on the male side, you're the one giving the high note, the female is expectant to what you'll do to her, where you'll take her, you start things on the male side, while on the female side you ends things.
    Get used to that drum roll, it's the base of the female approach to sexuality. As male you'll want to make this drum roll find an end, to conclude it. Ways to conclude the drum roll: create internal pressure, force things, create external pressure.

    Now for the interesting part. Once you spend quite some time creating space within yourself (ie. as pleasure escalates, instead of creating internal pressure, you relax even more), you reach a point where you actually CAN tense up, while keeping your internal organs relaxed. Whenever a super-o hits you, you tend to move like crazy, fireworks everywhere, etc. 

    Is to be rewired when the drum roll stops being felt as such? Instead of a drum roll it's felt as a continuous wave of pleasure of varying intensities?

    A useful tip... see the aneros as an extremely sensitive penis, if you're to rough with it, it will ejaculate and the fun will be over. Treat it carefully, if you're pressing it in some way inside you'll make it cum, relax, give it space. When you're pressing it, not only you'll be pushing it closer to ejaculation, you'll also be desensitizing the area which is pressing it. When you're able to deal with that approach permanently, you'll be on the right path to the super-o, when you get rid of the impulse to make the drum roll finish, and instead, actually enjoy it, enjoy the anticipation.

    So a female, relaxed, passive, expansive state is required to experience a full body mind blowing super o. Relaxed = no internal or external pressure, let it be or it will cum too soon. Passive = paying attention (senses, erogenous zones, sensitivity) to what's going on, especially keeping in mind the "non-invasive" state, you don't want to make it cum as soon as it gets in. Also, picture what the device is doing to your prostate, is it rubbing it alongways? Is it rubbing it sideways? Is it "holding" it?. Expansive = don't focus your sensations, expand them to your whole body, but don't be afraid to focus on some other parts too, though, only for a little while. Your expansive approach is to involve as many parts as you possibly can, without focusing either on your prostate or your penis, they will find their own place on their own as pleasure escalates. Include not only the prostate side, but the other side too. Play with internal pressure, never create too much, always let it be, move your internal organs as a whole, up and down, etc.
    You reach a point where you're "trapped". It just won't let you go or won't let you be. In this point, anything that's done to your prostate it feels extremely pleasurable, and if you did the previous work right, that pleasure will expand to the rest of your body. Remember, expand, relax, be receptive.

    Help yourself with a relaxed breath too. A blank state of mind helps a lot too.


    Take care.
  • @JMay, i think your spot on.  Feeling submissive and submissive to the aneros are key.  I was actually feeling that way in retrospect after one of my best super O's i had last night,  It was a strange feeling for me to actually feel that way as a guy.
  • Wecome back, Jmay. You were missed. And what a wonderful metaphor you're giving us to understand our inner life. The gender distinction, the sensitive penis, the drum roll, the expect------ation. So as I hear you, you're saying that in addition to penis-not, now we have tension-not? Sounds like just pure awareness of the drum roll of our arousal. A radically do-nothing approach with awareness.

    I've been doing something that Chuck inspired, breathing energy up my spine to my head and around back down my heart, abdomen penis and prostate. I don't know exactly what this is doing but it's fun and seems to be the right thing to do. Is it? I'll be listening for that long drum roll now.
  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    The thing is that when you use your penis, you'll tend to create internal pressure. You can use it, as long as you can handle it without doing that. In fact I encourage you to use it, it's harder that way (no pun intended), but you'll be able to distinguish much better when you create internal pressure or not. When you can stimulate it, keeping a relaxed state, you'll be successfully in the super o path.

    You can use PC muscles, you can use anal sphincters, yes, of course. I encourage you to use them too, but always keeping your internal organs relaxed, whenever you "fall back" it should be towards a relaxed state, not a forcing state. Use them to "hear" what's going on inside, not with a specific goal (create pleasure), but always to get your bearings down there.

    Yes, breathing energy up your spine is key to not focus sensations, expand them, give them that path. Never contract, only relax. Whenever pleasure recedes at first, take that time to breathe energy up your spine, instead of creating internal pressure to force pleasure.


    I'll try to explain it a little better.
    I want you to notice that you have internal organs, and that you have limbs and external stuff. The most important thing to keep relaxed are internal organs. We as men tend to create a lot of pressure as soon as we feel a little pleasure. You can use your limbs, your anal sphincters, they get things moving. You can use them as long as your internal organs are relaxed. You must be really aware of your breath, it helps to either create internal pressure or dissolve it.


    Now, after the drum roll gets intense enough, the aneros, much like a magnet, will know exactly what to do to stimulate your prostate. Never lose the submissive state, the relaxed hearing state, make yourself go crazy waiting for things to get good. Eventually you'll be able to process the drum roll as pure pleasure... hence it is an "aquired taste".

    By the way, thanks for the kind words.
  • chuckN
    Posts: 23
    Thanks for the new insight JMay. I'll be trying it out tonight. Relaxed, passive, submissive, expansive - a mantra.

  • isvara
    Posts: 572
    @JMay,
    Thank you for this. I have just had quite a conversation with my wife (female) about this. Basically you are correct. Relaxed receptive passivity. For her there is not much to tense up. Any erectile tissue is minimal. With female masturbation it all remains floppy so as to speak. The exception may be squirting. With me as I began to lose the ability to ejaculate I tried harder by tensing up everything "down there" to the point I was defeating the objective and bordering on over straining my heart. Really bad stuff. I found Aneros just in time and this was good. Now twenty months with Aneros I have been forced into more passivity. With sex, once erect, the more I can relax the internal muscles/organs the better it is. The more I do not respond to the penile stimulation the more tingles I have, now they are spreading over to the right side of my head. It has just occurred to me in my life I may never have had a real orgasm (whole body). It it going to be quite difficult to unlearn the tension response of 60 years, but what a challenge. My wife says, but why do you tense up. I say well its a man thing. She feels it is all much better for her and feels better if I "don't try" that is don't instinctively respond. This post is a bit premature but I am very excited now about the forced change of direction and thank you for confirming it.
  • wow....this post you made jmay. It changed alot of things immediately for me! i tried your advice last night, and was receptive and did the exact opposite of what i usually do....lets just say opening my feminine side made me wake up in the middle of the night without an aneros in with HUGE pleasure waves. so intense i didnt know what to do. great stuff.
  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    There's another important thing that I forgot to mention. Lube up a finger and feel your anus from the outside, you'll notice that theres a sphincter that you can relax, which is the outer one. Once that sphincter is fully relaxed you will encounter a second sphincter which will probably be closed, tensed up. This sphincter isn't under our control like the outer one. Before putting anything in, you must work on relaxing both sphincters, by massaging them. When that second sphincter is relaxed, it makes everything much easier. Notice how it responds too, it's the first sphincter to shut down as soon as you lose the relaxed receptive state. See it as an indicator as to whether you're ready to recieve or not.



    Looking forward to see how it went!

    @isvara

    I'm really glad and I wish you good luck too! Keep in mind that if you start feeling pain somewhere, it's an area that's tensed up, you must work it by focusing the sensations somewhere else. For example, if you're feeling discomfort because you're always about to ejaculate, well, that's not the path you should be taking, you're focusing your sensations somewhere where ejaculatory pathways are activated, you shouldn't focus on ejaculation at all (neither 'ooh how bad is it that I must hold back' or 'this is going to feel really great, I'll do it'), you should be focusing on expanding the sensations and the discomfort should recede, when you focus your sensations too much down there, things will tense up and you'll be ready to ejaculate, holding it back may create discomfort. When "holding back ejaculation" isn't a thing, you'll be well on your way to be really relaxed. Remember to breathe!
    Listen to your wife too, she might be able to coach you through it. Also if you could share with us any valuable insights she comes up that would be great too :D



    Pretty cool, huh? :D
    Remember this though... at first you'll be handling much more pleasure than you're used to. Be very careful to how you end a session. The first times you do this, you'll want to end up ejaculating, it will be strong as heck, but try not to do that. Not only it will deplete you, it will also desensitize you. You lose life force with each ejaculation. It's very easy to ejaculate over and over once you dominate this approach, but I insist, don't do that, you can harm yourself that way, you can even make yourself sick and feel weak for a long time.
    I'll tell you more... when you don't end up ejaculating, you keep all that energy that you gathered from your sexual energy for yourself! See what changes it makes in your well being in general. Give it time, first a couple of weeks, then months. You'll notice many changes in yourself, all for good!
    Don't punish yourself if you ejaculate though. It's a natural part of our being, and keep in mind also that you're learning. Don't be harsh to yourself.
  • TEK
    Posts: 21
    @JMay

    I must say, you are a great resource for this forum. Most of your threads should be sticky's imo.

    From your threads I gather that you've probably studied a bit of Mantak Chia's work. Have you also heard of or  Dr Lin's anal breathing method? It's very similar to Chia's excercises.

    I've also tried "the fire breathing" method, which seems to be able to generate orgasmic feelings. Have you heard of it?


  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    @TEK

    Thanks!
    Yes, I've studied Mantak Chia's work, which I couldn't understand as well as I do now. There's a book that was recommended on another forum that has helped me understand it even better,It's by Pokras & Somraj "Tantric Male Multiple G-Spot Orgasm". Get it!

    What's the "fire breathing" method like?
  • TEK
    Posts: 21
    @JMay

    These are the steps of "fire breathing":

    1. Lay down on a the floor, preferably on a mat of some kind so that it's not too hard on your back.

    2. As you take a long inbreath through your nose, arch your lower back. Your stomach becomes rounded as if you had a basket ball in it.

    3. As you breath out, bring your lower back back down and press it gently into the floor, creating a kind of rocking of the pelvis. Also, as you breath out, gently contract the anal sphincter, preferably also the muscles that run up the back to the tailbone.

    A few additions, if you find it useful:

    - On the outbreath, you can also let out an "aaaahhh" sound through your mouth.

    - Feel energy flowing up your spine and up to your head. I prefer visualizing the microcosmic orbit.
  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    I will try it, thanks.

    I think I found another key element here, though I think it comes from mastering belly breathing.

    When you do belly breathing you use three of your body's diaphragms. Once you are able to recognise in your body those three, AND learn to move the middle one independently, you can do this.

    Whenever the aneros is in, you must shape that area like a tube, for the aneros to be slightly caressing the walls without any pressure. The middle diaphragm is the one that's going to do most of the work by pulling everything up and giving it space. In other words, use your parts as though they were a pussy... the lips being the sphincters, the G spot being the prostate, you get the idea... but it will only work as long as you shape it internally. Your only job here is to maintain the shape inside, give it a way to pass through. That slight indirect stimulation is what really gets everything turned on. This "indirect" stimulation is indirect because it's without pressure, only touching lightly the walls, because you are giving it the shape where it needs to pass through.
    Think of it as an internal erection, as weird as it may sound. This will only work as long as your rectal walls are "erect" giving it the shape for another erect thing to go through.
    Your penis can actually go soft without losing any sensitivity.

    Rectal walls "not erect" = start getting a strong erection outside. When that happens the walls collapse on themselves.
    Rectal walls "erect" = your main focus becomes that part where the g-spot is. As long as you maintain them erect, the ejaculatory response shouldn't be present, giving only sensitivity to the penis. Whenever you focus directly on your penis, the walls will tend to collapse on themselves, creating internal pressure, losing the "internal erection"... just maintain that shape, and let go of the rest.
  • @JMay I've certainly learned to appreciate your postings here my friend!

    Enjoying myself in this relaxed, passive, expansive state is probably why it has been possible to achieve mind blowing super o's with my girlfriend giving me just blow jobs. Intercourse demands such physical efforts from a man that it's a different game, at least for me so far as I just recently experienced these super Os when "receiving".

    I still haven't had super Os with my Aneros though, but perhaps it's just as you described it. When receiving e.g. blow jobs from a woman, I find it easier to relax, perhaps because there is more contrast: I'm stimulated strongly, but aren't really working for it as she's giving and I'm receiving, so I just fall back, relax and enjoy the sensations and the moment, and then it happens. Yet with Aneros, the stimulation obviously is not as strong/obvious, so it becomes more challenging psychologically because I easily start "forcing" a bit to create some tension, like "okay, nothing's happening, let's make something happen". I need to try to apply your insights into practice.

    On the side note, it's interesting that I've talked to many of my women friends about these long electrifying full body Os and although some are used to having multiple Os, none of them seem to have experienced anything as powerful and long. Hard to say what it feels like for them, but I think that finding prostate orgasms is a pretty advanced level in male sexuality. When, for example, I read @JMay's posts, it's obvious that it tends to come with a lot of deep and philosophical thinking as well. 

    Anyhow, good postings, looking forward to reading more!
  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    @Electrified

    Thanks!
    Put to test your will power, stay there no matter what. Eventually you'll understand it better so you'll enjoy it more.
    It doesn't turn you gay or anything like that AFAIK, I'm still in love with the same woman and all...
    You can be hours orgasming dude...
  • @JMay gotta love your supporting tone brother! You're like a coach man, "believe in yourself, you can do it"! That's awesome, haha! :D
  • TEK
    Posts: 21
    @JMay

    Interesting that you should mention breathing. I came across a book which is called "Breathing Ecstasy" by a couple named Gay and Kathlyn Hendricks. Now in that book they describe how breathing the wrong way and tensing up triggers the ejaculation reflex.
    The book also gives you a series of exercises that is designed to help you breath and move the right way, so as to not trigger that reflex. The moving part is actually very similar to the fire breathing technique.

    Thought you might find that interesting. :) The couple has written more books I think.
  • Tek, the fire breathing that you described sounds like something I started doing recently. I do the same movements but I pull energy up my spine to my head and around back down the front of my body to my prostate and anus with each breath. I can feel the warmth coming from my heart and the coolness coming from my anus. Kind of a circulation thing. I just started doing it after learning some tantric no-hands energy moving. It just seemed like the right thing to do. I do it when I'm thinking about it anytime of the day and during sessions. If I'm relaxed I can eventually have this breathing without thinking about it during sessions. I didn't know what to call it so I called it tantric breathing but I looked that up and it's not that. I like your fire breathing, reminds me of a dragon. I'll look for the books you mention.
  • TEK
    Posts: 21
    @euphemistic

    Sounds like you are doing the microcosmic orbit. I do that too during a session, drawing energy up the spine on the inbreath up to the top of the head and down to the third eye position. Then on the outbreath the energy goes down the face, throat, heart, lower dantien and back down to the pelvic region.

    I do that for while, and then I add slight anal contraction on the inbreath. This is the "anal breathing method" of Dr Lin.

    I guess one can combine this with the rocking of the pelvis ala fire breathing. I must try this, though I think I will have to cut of the curly part of the aneros. Otherwise it will be pressed into the floor every time.

    May I suggest that you also try putting your tongue to the roof of your mouth? According to Taoism, this connects the front and back energy channels. Maybe that will make the energy flow better.

    May I ask, what was the "tantric no-hands energy moving" technique you learned?
  • I meant to say"no touch" energy moving technique as opposed to the using touch. BigOluver described it today in his blog, something we both learned from someone here. You probably do it already. It's that tingling force that you feel when your hand is hovering a little over your body or your palms are almost touching, thus no touch. You can move the energy around or concentrate it on a certain spot.

    I could not find the Ecstatic Energy book on Amazon or at the library. Thanks for the suggestions and for knowing what I was talking about. I'll try them. Sometimes when the warm energy is passing through my heart, it feels like it changes into emotion. It's a similar feeling to letting go.
  • TEK
    Posts: 21
    @euphemistic

    Yeah, that's not entirely foreign to me. I do Qigong every day, and moving the body in specific ways does help moving energy in the body. The "tingling force" as you say is what the Chinese call Qi. The energy that is everything. :)

    If you mean the book "Breathing Ecstasy" that I mentioned, it's right here:

    Regarding energy changing into emotion when passing through the heart... That is totally understandable to me. According to old wisdom, it is when thought and emotion marries in the heart that magic happens. You might want to look up Gregg Braden. He talks a lot about this. There's a few videos with him on Youtube.
  • Thank you Tek. I'm eager to understand more about this.

    Later

    Yeow! it's so expensive. I found their other books at the virtual library, Breathing and Centering and Spiritual Relationships. I'll start with them. A friend gave me a book about mindfulness last month, mabe I will read that too.
  • TEK
    Posts: 21
    @euphemistic

    Ah, okay. I've not read that one, so I cannot really say anything about it.

    I can say this though, that if you are interested in energy work and moving energy, Qigong is definately something you should consider. I've only practiced it a few weeks, but I can already feel the energy moving in me. And I feel great also. :)
  • The little I know about qigong sounds like just what I need. My neighborhood is 40 percent asian so there's probably something going on here. I'll ask my neighbors about it. Thanks again, Tek.
  • @JMay you may have very well nailed it here with the idea of "dominating vs. submissive".

    I've asked myself this philosophical question why on earth is the prostate located where it's located. Found a couple insightful excerpts that would support your thoughts about adopting this different approach, as in surrendering to pleasure:

    "As powerful as physiological stimulation might be, it pales when compared to the immeasurably greater psychological or mental high. The very notion of the male placing himself into such a vulnerable position, results in a powerful mental rush. The willingness of the naturally controlling male to allow himself to be placed in an unaccustomed submissive role, should be particularly cherished by the giver."
  • rumelrumel
    Posts: 2,253
    JMay,

    I think you've done a nice job of expanding upon the idea of letting go of control that I expressed back in September of last year, in that post post ("Just Let Go !")
    rumel said:

    ...Finally, one needs to let go of the traditional notion of controlling the action and results as dictated by your ego consciousness. The immense interest in the Pegging thread attests to our members openness to alternative pleasure paths. This is another paradigm shift in thinking for most men, from assertive/aggressive/penetrative control to a passive/submissive/receptive surrender of control to your own subconscious. This is not about relinquishing control of your life to another human being nor is it a power exchange or any form of Dominance/submission scene, it is about suspending egocentric judgment so the powerful richness of your primitive self can be expressed through your body's pleasure.


    image Good Vibes to You ! image
  • JMay
    Posts: 113
    Thanks for the input, guys. I'll be checking those things out.

    By the way... I think I found something else. The position of the aneros when inside should be primarily towards your spine, trying to pull it back so it's parallel to it. This makes the most sensitive part be free of constant pressure, but the shape of the device should be felt much better and more defined as the session goes by.

    The other thing is that you should take it like an internal erection, trying to mirror the penis. The tip of the device should be stimulating an area which is as sensitive as the tip of the penis, the middle part of the device should be felt as the middle part of the penis, except that you have your g-spot there too. The first part of the device, same thing, should be similar to the base of the penis. The key here is to never let the device rest too much on the prostate side, try to keep it always as parallel to the spine as possible. This, I guess, gives enough space to that area where the prostate is, letting more blood circulate through it, making it larger and more sensitive. Eventually, still keeping the device parallel to the spine, the p-tab and the rest of the aneros will trap your prostate area. To this point, remember to pay attention to the "mirror penis", remember to focus on each different part, then include them all. When pulling it in, try to reach as far inside as possible, considering that the part that's reaching out to is as sensitive as the tip of the penis, if not more. So do that with each slow breath you take in. Remember to relax also.

    This is kind of interesting too. In women, the part of the brain that processes pain is the same that processes pleasure, which seems to be the reason for BDSM to exist. When you do this. you'll be feeling discomfort, which is not painful, it's just very uncomfortable for a while. I swear there's a point where this discomfort starts to be felt along with pleasure. Then both sensations kind of fuse together, but it's not bad, if you handle the discomfort for a long time, eventually you'll desensitize in some way the area that is feeling discomfort, when that happens and its left a little numb, discomfort turns into another kind of pleasure. At this point, most probably your prostate will be almost ready to become a source of continuous pleasure, about to swell quite a lot. You'll want to fix the position of the p-tab at this point, you'll be able to find the perfect spot. Remember that you're not applying too much pressure to your prostate because the device is being pulled towards your spine. You must warm up every part first, turn them on so they start working.
    Picture this. If you were to expand the device (to scale) so that it's the same size of your body, the tip of the device would be on your head, the prostate area would be close to your heart, etc. Connect those feelings at the tip and try to transmit them to your head. Get the idea? If on a level it's stimulating an area, that small area represents a larger part of your body, like, the tip of the device, stimulates the head area, so it is also stimulated, indirectly. The prostate makes you love the experience (heart). etc.


    Take your time.