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mental manipulation of energy into mind induced orgasms
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    It's been over a month now since the last time I've used my hands (or the aneros) for masturbation. Well except for nipple stim which I stopped as well a couple weeks ago. A little over a month ago I started doing Kegal excercises (or are they called something else for men?) several times a day. I was working with masturbating to the threshold of orgasm and then really squeezing my PC or BC muscle at that point to be able to go into the orgasm for a few seconds and then have it subside before fully going over the edge and then repeating the process over and over until I would go to far and ejaculate.

    I then took this practice into sex with my girl with amazing results being able to hold back just like I would while masturbating and doing this over and over till I would go too far and ejaculate.
    Then about a month ago I decided to stop masturbating with my hands (basically no physical simulation to the penis). I started focusing more on meditation and energy work (working with the chakras type stuff) and have been learning to move this energy around the body very well.

    During masturbation I now mentally move all this energy as well as I can into the prostate or the "genital chakra". This is fully not recommended in some chakra books I've read. They normally recommend skipping this chakra or work very little on it because too often it will disrupt the energy work because working with this chakra typically causes arousal and one thing often leads to another and before you know it the energy work is out the door and you're masturbating... this is why I keep regular energy work and masturbation energy work separate). I remember when I was younger I had the hardest time meditating cause I would always become so aroused that I'd end up just masturbating.

    The energy builds and builds until eventually I get erect and then I'll hold a very slight PC or BC contraction until I feel an orgasm begin and then I let go of the contraction and relax into the orgasm. The penis will start jumping around and moving around like a snake for awhile before the full blown orgasm takes over. So far these orgasms are lasting longer and longer sometimes up to a few minutes. But it's not a dry orgasm. At the end of the orgasm I always ejaculate. Again I never do any physical stimulation at all.

    Two weeks ago I was still doing nipple stim during this practice cause it felt like it brought on even more energy but decided to stop doing that because I felt maybe that was the reason why I kept ejaculating instead of having dry O's. I stopped the nipple stim which I felt was better cause now It's nearly all my mental manipulation of energy to achieve long orgasms except for the very slight PC or BC contraction I hold after getting erect until the orgasm "really" begins. The build up to the orgasm is very pleasurable as well and is becoming better and better with practice too.

    I feel I'm making tremendous progress though can't figure out why I keep ejaculating even though I'm using no physical stimulation. I'm thinking it's the very slight contraction that is maybe causing this and will attempt to achieve orgasms with just pure mental energy manipulation. So far I've yet to be able to accomplish this and that's why I keep using the slight contraction after getting the erection. I build this energy and attempt to keep it in the prostate or genital chakra. I try not to get an erection because I feel once the erection happens there's a transfer of energy and that's why it turns into a wet orgasm. But the energy always builds to a certain level and the erection seems like it can't be stopped.

    The whole process so far can take as little as a few minutes to reach orgasm when the energy is really flowing. I've experimented with using porn as well as just focusing on the energy. I've found that porn brings about the erection much quicker and I have less control of the energy. Both ways are very enjoyable but I think I need to focus more on the non porn sessions because I feel if I could avoid the erection and keep the energy in the prostate that I'll be able to achieve the multiple dry O's this way.

    It's very enjoyable knowing that I've been able to leave traditional orgasm in the dust into new ways of experiencing pleasure and orgasm. Now just need to figure out how to have multiples using this method instead of ending in a wet orgasm.

    Any Ideas of why I keep having wet orgasms even though I'm using no physical stimulation?
  • I have no idea, this is way beyond my level of expertise. Maybe some one else has some advice?
  • Pan
    Posts: 249
    Billy11 said:

    It's been over a month now since the last time I've used my hands (or the aneros) for masturbation. Well except for nipple stim which I stopped as well a couple weeks ago. A little over a month ago I started doing Kegal excercises (or are they called something else for men?) several times a day. I was working with masturbating to the threshold of orgasm and then really squeezing my PC or BC muscle at that point to be able to go into the orgasm for a few seconds and then have it subside before fully going over the edge and then repeating the process over and over until I would go to far and ejaculate.

    I then took this practice into sex with my girl with amazing results being able to hold back just like I would while masturbating and doing this over and over till I would go too far and ejaculate.
    Then about a month ago I decided to stop masturbating with my hands (basically no physical simulation to the penis). I started focusing more on meditation and energy work (working with the chakras type stuff) and have been learning to move this energy around the body very well.

    During masturbation I now mentally move all this energy as well as I can into the prostate or the "genital chakra". This is fully not recommended in some chakra books I've read. They normally recommend skipping this chakra or work very little on it because too often it will disrupt the energy work because working with this chakra typically causes arousal and one thing often leads to another and before you know it the energy work is out the door and you're masturbating... this is why I keep regular energy work and masturbation energy work separate). I remember when I was younger I had the hardest time meditating cause I would always become so aroused that I'd end up just masturbating.

    The energy builds and builds until eventually I get erect and then I'll hold a very slight PC or BC contraction until I feel an orgasm begin and then I let go of the contraction and relax into the orgasm. The penis will start jumping around and moving around like a snake for awhile before the full blown orgasm takes over. So far these orgasms are lasting longer and longer sometimes up to a few minutes. But it's not a dry orgasm. At the end of the orgasm I always ejaculate. Again I never do any physical stimulation at all.

    Two weeks ago I was still doing nipple stim during this practice cause it felt like it brought on even more energy but decided to stop doing that because I felt maybe that was the reason why I kept ejaculating instead of having dry O's. I stopped the nipple stim which I felt was better cause now It's nearly all my mental manipulation of energy to achieve long orgasms except for the very slight PC or BC contraction I hold after getting erect until the orgasm "really" begins. The build up to the orgasm is very pleasurable as well and is becoming better and better with practice too.

    I feel I'm making tremendous progress though can't figure out why I keep ejaculating even though I'm using no physical stimulation. I'm thinking it's the very slight contraction that is maybe causing this and will attempt to achieve orgasms with just pure mental energy manipulation. So far I've yet to be able to accomplish this and that's why I keep using the slight contraction after getting the erection. I build this energy and attempt to keep it in the prostate or genital chakra. I try not to get an erection because I feel once the erection happens there's a transfer of energy and that's why it turns into a wet orgasm. But the energy always builds to a certain level and the erection seems like it can't be stopped.

    The whole process so far can take as little as a few minutes to reach orgasm when the energy is really flowing. I've experimented with using porn as well as just focusing on the energy. I've found that porn brings about the erection much quicker and I have less control of the energy. Both ways are very enjoyable but I think I need to focus more on the non porn sessions because I feel if I could avoid the erection and keep the energy in the prostate that I'll be able to achieve the multiple dry O's this way.

    It's very enjoyable knowing that I've been able to leave traditional orgasm in the dust into new ways of experiencing pleasure and orgasm. Now just need to figure out how to have multiples using this method instead of ending in a wet orgasm.

    Any Ideas of why I keep having wet orgasms even though I'm using no physical stimulation?



    Hey Billy11,

    without knowing exactly what energy/chakra practices you're currently doing (and a whole host of other details), it's difficult to be sure why your energetic orgasms have been ending in ejaculation.

    However, my first impressions are that the initial focus of containing energy in the prostate may be somewhat over-stimulating for you at this time, and the body's natural impulse when that area becomes over-stimulated is to dump the excess energy through ejaculation.

    The use of PC/BC/Kegel exercises tend to stimulate the prostate as well. You are, in effect, "priming the pump" with each contraction. So it definitely qualifies as "physical stimulation" in my book. It might help to take a break from those exercises until you've developed an effective, alternative release valve.

    Typically, the combination of both mentally and physically stimulating the prostate exclusively without providing a clear escape route (i.e. kundalini, microcosmic orbit, Key Sound, etc) leaves only one inevitable result - ejaculation. The Aneros is rather unique in this respect. Many practitioners can enjoy dozens upon dozens of Super-O's (effectively supercharging the prostate for hours) without ejaculating.

    Perhaps, since your practice has always ended in ejaculation with or without multiple/dry orgasms, your body and mind have been trained to view each practice session as "incomplete" until you finish it with an ejaculation?

    You might want to consider altering your practice so that you can still enjoy the pleasures of arousal without engaging the processes which lead to ejaculation.

    I can think of a couple suggestions:

    1. Change your chakra focus.

    Instead of focusing on containing energy in your prostate, have you ever tried stimulating your third eye or crown with erotic energy? I find third eye and crown chakra orgasms to be extremely pleasurable and once achieved, easy to maintain, almost indefinitely. There are a couple Western New Age techniques which stimulate areas of the brain (the amygdala and the septum pellucidum) physiologically equivalent to these chakras through simple visualizations. One is called "amygdala clicking" www.neilslade.com and the other is called the Joy Touch method, found in the book "Access Your Brain's Joy Center" by Pete A. Sanders Jr. I have gotten excellent results from both techniques, but find the Joy Touch method more effective and easier to learn.

    Regardless of which technique you use, the end result is still heightened arousal, intense orgasmic pleasure, and all while focusing away from your genitals, thereby making ejaculation less likely and PC contractions unnecessary.

    2. The Key Sound Multiple Orgasm technique or KSMO.

    In KSMO practice (the first MMO method I learned), the goal of each session is not to achieve orgasms, but simply to learn how to expand your level of arousal through the use of The Key Sound, without ever approaching The Point of No Return. This is done by recognizing and gently avoiding the physiological processes associated with ejaculation (PC contractions, shallow breathing, muscular tension, etc) and relaxing through them, essentially retraining your body and mind's response to erotic stimulation to create a positive feedback loop of deep relaxation = more arousal = more powerful orgasmic release = deeper relaxation and so on...

    KSMO is the most consistently effective and adaptive MMO method I know of. Once learned, it enables one to enjoy orgasms virtually at will, with or without physical stimulation, solo or with a partner, and all while completely bypassing the urge to ejaculate. I can't recommend it highly enough.

    3. EFT, NLP, and Self-hypnosis:

    There are some great little techniques out there that are highly effective for re-training the body and mind's response to erotic stimulation. Just focus on your desired outcome and use whichever technique(s) you find most appealing to convey that choice to your subconscious. Once your subconscious gets the message, your body will often make the changes for you.

    EFT, among other things, acts as an amazingly simple and effective form of self-hypnosis, and can be learned for free at www.emofree.com. NLP and self-hypnosis techniques are freely available all over the Net, just start googling. But the best all-in-one introduction to NLP I've found is "Get the Life You Want" by Richard Bandler. It describes some of the easiest and most effective NLP techniques such as Anchoring, Swish Patterns, and Spinning Feelings in terms anyone can understand. And each of these can be used to help create the results you desire.

    There's also plenty of professionally recorded hypnosis Cd's and mp3's available. This particular program (one of my favorites) http://hypnosis.hyptalk.com/pd_super_hypnotic.cfm involves the use of the chakras as well as methods to program your subconscious with your ideal orgasmic response.

    Well, I hope at least some of this is helpful and congratulations on your progress so far! I'm sure it's only a matter of refining your approach until you get the results you're looking for.

    Best of luck on your journey,

    Pan
  • BigE
    Posts: 45
    From what you've described and from other sources I've read, it looks like the problem is that you are not circulating the energy. The point of energy alchemy practices like Mantak Chia teaches is to use the sexual energy for healing by circulating it through the body. This is why he teaches the microcosmic orbit. If there are blockages or the energy is not circulating it only has one place to go; out via ejaculation. Guys who are far more experienced than myself do not recommend starting sexual energy work until they can do the microcosmic orbit.

    I practice yoga and some qi gong and have played around with moving sexual energy. I'm an edger when masturbating in the traditional manner. I'm getting away from the hard pc clenches and now contract the anus with gentle squeezing. From my yoga work I'm learning to relax and breath through the orgasms and avoiding ejaculation without any clinching or squeezing at all. Simply sitting still, following the breath while all the good stuff that happens during an orgasm is going on is pure bliss.

    Maybe you should take a sabbatical from the energy work, simply meditate and just enjoy your sexuality in whatever form it takes.
  • OH!!
    Posts: 260
    As for the wet orgasms I have them too and like them, but certainly don't have as many lately as I used to. I miss them. :cry: Why do you have them? I think it has a lot to do with how excited and aroused you are. Perhaps the amount of prostate fluid retained has something to do with it too. In other words the more fluid the more pressure during stimulation. I have found I tend to ejaculate more when I am on all fours as opposed to on my back which makes sense as gravity would push more on the Aneros and prostate in the all fours position. Enjoy them. Happy journeys...
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    Wow, not sure how I missed the reply's here on this thread. I just pulled it up to post an update on how things are going not realizing that people had replied to this. Sorry for the delay.

    Pan- Thanks for all of your advice. I really do appreciate it for sure. I actually just purchased the KSMO a few days ago and have read a lot of your posts on the multiples forum through out the last week. Very informative and helpful. Thank you. I will also look into the links you posted.
    Oh ya and I fully agree with you about th PC/BC contractions being stimulation. I've learned that full relaxation of the genitals is key to achieve multiples (not using the aneros). Now I don't even do any contractions at all cause this just leads to ejaculation.

    Oh!!! and BigE- A big thanks for your replies as well. Very helpful.

    So as for my update.....
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    This is a copy and paste from a PM I sent a few days ago.

    Wow!
    Ok I finally purchased the KSMO Yesterday afternoon and listened to the main part of the down load where Jack demonstrates the KS and pretty much talks a lot about teaching yourself how to experience pleasure in new ways and so on. I was a little disappointed about it cause other than the KS it really didn't present anything new to me except the idea of using the KS as a way to release the sexual energy while orgasming instead of ejaculating.

    So after listening the the download, I practiced doing the KS a bit but not really doing it as if I was doing a session. But soon after, my GF calls and needs a ride home from work.
    She knows I DL the KSMO and so I demonstrated the KS for her and it was just hard to do it without her and I laughing.
    Well Later on that evening, we end up having sex and well....

    For the first time ever, I managed to redirect the sexual energy and not long into the sex, I began having orgasm after orgasm. Waves of them. Body shaking, me vocalizing like never before. The KS was silly when I tried to do it for her but during the sex the KS didn't feel silly at all. Specially being in a state of near constant orgasm for about 45 minutes. It was amazing. And finally the ejaculation I had was explosive. Thing is though is that I didn't even do any KS until after I was already having the orgasms. It's when the orgasm would begin to feel like it may turn into a ejaculation is when I started doing the KS.

    Then like 2 hours later when lying down for bed we went again and again ended up in orgasmic bliss though not as good as the first.
    Then after going to bed I wake up maybe 6 hours later and while trying to go back to sleep, I ended up having a bunch of mini O's for maybe half and hour.

    So basically I haven't even done a session of KSMO yet but took the understanding of the KS right into sex and experienced the best sex I've ever had.
    Now I understand that the next time we have sex it may not be the same. I remember having my early success with the aneros and thinking that I was in heaven because of how easy it was for the aneros to give me multiples but then not long after that, the aneros seemed to barely arouse me. But I feel I've definitely unlocked something that I can now tap into for sure.

    One thing I think that helped put me into that state last night was I've been learning how to relax my genital area during sex especially as the arousal builds getting closer to orgasm. Instead of contracting my PC muscle or trying to "hold back", I "let go" and relax my genitalia us much as possible. By doing this I can feel deep down at the base of my penis begin to swell and it seems like the energy gathers there. Then what happened yesterday is that instead of this energy going further up the penis it instead went back into me and from there it was orgasms galore.
    Anyway, I've been feeling like I've been on the verge of being able to do this but how strange that I accomplish the MMO during sex on the same day that I finally buy the KSMO!
  • I havent heard of KSMO, but I had a strange experience a few nights ago while trying to sleep.

    Just laying in bed trying to fall asleep like every night, It usually takes me an hour in bed before I can. It was probably close to an hour being in bed when my ears start ringing quietly at first, gaining in volume quickly. I feel this strong vibration pulse in my head and move throughout my body. I couldnt really move or react to this when it was happening, I was fully aware and sorta freaked out. It pulsed for about 2 seconds, 4 times and stopped.

    I have heard of chakras and the whole energy thing, never really read into it though. Was this related to that because of how hard I was focusing on trying to sleep???
  • B MayfieldB Mayfield
    Posts: 2,077
    Dr. Unk,

    What had you been doing prior to going to sleep? Had there been a session at some point during the day? If so, what had been the outcome?


    BF Mayfield
  • I think I did have a session earlier that day with my progasm. It was just the usual for me, no O's but my legs did spasm a few times. It was the first time they had ever done that, I was on my back and one leg twitched strongly to the side, then the other. Other than that I had just been relaxing, nothing special.
  • B MayfieldB Mayfield
    Posts: 2,077
    Dr. Unk,

    It's possible that what you're experiencing are neural transients as a result of the "rewiring process". The awakening of the prostate often involves random discharges of energy like this. Furthermore, when there has been insufficient release of the energy accumulated during a session it possible to experience episodes like this. Ejaculation will often "ground" this energy, but sometimes not.

    Did focusing on sleep cause it? Probably not. The fact that you're experiencing some insomnia might give further indication that your mind and body are bit out of synch. In addition to ejaculation, consumption of heavy meals, alcohol, and herbal teas such as Valerian or Skullcap have been known to provide relief. Focused breathing and relaxation techniques such as used in self-hypnosis, Yoga, Tai Chi, and Chi Gung have also been suggested.


    BF Mayfield
  • B MayfieldB Mayfield
    Posts: 2,077
    Billy 11,

    First, congratulations on your journey! How wonderful it is that it's led you to this whole other realm of sensuality.

    Regarding your tendency toward ejaculation. I concur with Pan,..take the focus off of your prostate. Furthermore, I'd pass on the porn, it doesn't appear that you need any outside source of arousal. Really at this point it amounts to working with the energy that you've been generating in these sessions in a more controlled way. I've used several of the techniques that Pan has recommended (KSMO, Amygdala Clicking, & self-hypnosis). KSMO and self hypnosis have been the best fit for me.

    Be sure to keep us apprised on the outcome with KSMO.

    BF Mayfield
  • That is a crazy story Billy11!
    Seems like you are on the fast track on everything!
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    Thanks Bishop!
    I've been feeling like I've been on the verge for awhile now of being able to have multiples. I really wasn't expecting it to happen first during sex though since stimulation of the penis and even PC/BC contractions seem to take the internal arousal and focus it into the penis. I thought I would learn how to do it with no stimulation and then have to figure out how to work it into sex since so far during sex I've had to just use the 'holding back' and contracting the PC/BC muscle right before ejaculating.
    So this was a very nice surprise.
    I really didn't give a very detailed description of what led up the the multiples. So here is another cut and paste from a PM of what happened first...
    The sex was spontanious first off. But she pulled my pants down and licked my penis and then began to rub her tit/tits on my 'hot spot' on the underside of my penis just below the head. Doing this I started having involuntaries to the point to where I was at the threshold of having multiples. I was so revved up that when I finally put her on her back and 'very slowly' inserted her, the first waves of O's were hitting. And I mean very slowly. As in first just resting my head on her lips and feeling the buzz. Then sliding in but taking maybe a full minute to get my penis even half way in. So the first waves of O's were hitting me before even barely penetrating her. For the most part I just stayed inserted but didn't fuck her like normal. As in I wasn't thrusting away or anything. I think this is a key element. I feel like too much stimulation in the beginning is what kills the internal feelings and transfers them mostly into your penis.
    But once the O's were hitting I found that I could thrust or penetrate much more without feeling like I was going to ejaculate. It's like once the internal O's begin, that there's no more worries of having to hold back though even still there was a few times during that session that I had to pull out for a second because I could feel that I was going to ejaculate but then I could continue on only seconds later with no problems.

    So I feel it's all about building arousal but with not too much stimulation. The way she was rubbing her tits on my hot spot wasn't like the same as if I was getting a hand job or full on oral. As in the stimulation was more of a arousal builder than something that would lead to an ejaculation. Then the feeling of sliding my penis into her was just what I needed to push me over the edge and begin the internal multiple orgasms.

    It's still all a learning experience because we had sex a couple days later and right away I could feel that there would be no multiples to be had. We didn't do enough arousing before penetration. Actually I was sort of on the verge of multiples before penetration but as soon as I penetrated her I could feel the energy shift and right away could feel the ejaculation reflex wanting to get involved. So after awhile of love making I decided to end it because I didn't want to ejaculate. Now that I've experienced what it's like to 'really' orgasm, It's hard to to settle for building arousal into one ejaculatory orgasm. Plus I feel by not ejaculating that next time we have sex, I'll have more energy to work with.
  • zanebluezaneblue
    Posts: 224
    Very interesting thread!

    My two cents, from a woman's point of view. If you are restricting ejaculation, make sure to save up your ejaculation for sex rather than masturbation. Women like to feel men's ejaculation during sex.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,488
    zaneblue said:

    Very interesting thread!

    My two cents, from a woman's point of view. If you are restricting ejaculation, make sure to save up your ejaculation for sex rather than masturbation. Women like to feel men's ejaculation during sex.



    Wonderful thread indeed!

    Good to have you join it ZB. Those males of us in an M/F couple and energy "work" recognize this very much. Mrs. a and I rarely end a session without a flying fluid finish Super-T! :shock:

    I've printed this thread am reading and rereading... back here later...

    great energetics experiences all

    artform
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    B Mayfield- Thanks for the congrats. Somehow when I first read your post I thought you were speaking to Dr Unk but now I clearly see it was for me. I can't agree with you and pan enough about taking my focus away from my prostate. I sometimes now focus on it right away to get the arousal going if I can't build it otherwise but then direct my attention away once the arousal starts to build. It's a whole different way to get aroused than in the past. I can just mentally think to become aroused and I do. And I've fully taken the porn out of the equation too. Yes it can bring arousal but it seems to be the arousal that leads to ejaculation. As in through the years of using porn for masterbation, the mind is used to using it to achieve ejaculation. And for me sexual thoughts or fantasies are in the same boat. Like if I'm building arousal and start to fantasize, then I can feel the arousal shift into more of a wanting ejaculation than being content with building it into what may come. So instead I need to build arousal and just feel it course through my body and not attempt to achieve orgasm but instead let it build and build to whatever happens.

    Zaneblue- I agree. Now that ejaculation doesn't quite have the same level of pleasure since I know of how much more pleasure there is to experience, I feel much less desire to want to ejaculate by myself. It's so not satisfying plus takes away from my energy to please my girl. I've decided from here on out that I'm no longer going to masterbate to ejaculation anymore. I'll do my aneroless sessions and KSMO but no more mentally crossing over to the point to where I switch from building arousal to wanting an orgasm pronto. I actually just learned my lesson on that one right before getting on this computer. I sort of had an accident... Which I'm going to post now...
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    Today I did my first session of KSMO. For me using the KS was very distracting to building arousal. But I'm sure I'll get the hang of it. After the KSMO session I wasn't really satisfied with it so decided to go right into my normal aneroless style session. I was having a hard time building arousal so focused on my prostate. This brought a little but not much so I decided to give my nipples two little flicks with my fingers. That instantly brought in the arousal but instead of it staying internal I slowly got an erection. Once erect I could feel the pleasure and pressure building and building at the base of my penis. It would get to the point to where I would feel like I was on the brink of orgasm and then it would hover there.
    Let me add here that I'm doing absolutely no pc/bc contractions of any kind. I'm instead staying relaxed as possible really focusing on keeping my genitals relaxed as possible.
    So at this point I decide to play with my nipples but just a little bit. Well this is all I needed to send me over the edge. I could feel an ejaculation coming on. I wanted to do a pc/bc contraction to stop it because I haven't ejaculated in a few days and didn't want to waste my energy but at the same time I reasoned with myself that I haven't done any muscle contracting at all and felt if maybe I just kept my genitals relaxed that instead it would turn into multiple O's with no ejaculation.
    I stopped touching my nipples as soon as I felt myself getting near orgasm. But it was too late. Now the only attempt to stop the impending ejaculation was to try to do a pc/bc contraction but decided against that again in hopes that as long as I stayed relaxed that it would turn into multiples...
    Well no such luck. I ended up having a hands free with very limited nipple stimulation ejaculation. So disappointing since I've been saving my sexual energy especially my ejaculation for my girl.

    The good side to this is that I learned a few important things from it. One, that for me even nipple stimulation is enough to bring ejaculation. I feel that it brings too much stimulation focused on the penis instead of the whole body. Two, like I said before, I feel that just having an erection brings too much stimulation to the penis and the energy is focused too much there instead of the whole body. So I need to build arousal as high as I can with no nipple stimulation or any other kind of stimulation of any kind and keep this arousal internal and if I do begin to become erect to stop all arousal thoughts and wait till I become fully limp before continuing on.
    Three, I finally proved to myself that whether I do pc/bc contractions or not, I will still have an ejaculation if I go about it in an attempt to have an orgasm instead of building the internal arousal into what may come from it. I previously was convinced that if I could bring myself to orgasm with no pc/bc contractions, that I would not ejaculate but instead at the very least have a dry orgasm instead... I was wrong about that one.
    Plus during that aneroless session I could feel myself wanting to have and orgasm as I felt it getting close and so I focused my attention on achieving that instead of focusing on the internal arousal. I guess I was just so excited that I was going to have an orgasm for the first time with absolutely no pc/bc contractions of any kind.
    Oh well learn from your mistakes right?
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,488
    Billy11, this is it! At least part of the core, I believe.

    Your details here are highly suggestive of the same thing mrs. a and I have experienced; the male/female energy exchange/balancing and the process described for it by Dr. Rudolph von Urban and Bio-electric Sex as outlined in my blog post on this topic: http://www.aneros.com/displayentry.php?id=257


    Billy11 said:

    Thanks Bishop!
    I've been feeling like I've been on the verge for awhile now of being able to have multiples. I really wasn't expecting it to happen first during sex though since stimulation of the penis and even PC/BC contractions seem to take the internal arousal and focus it into the penis. I thought I would learn how to do it with no stimulation and then have to figure out how to work it into sex since so far during sex I've had to just use the 'holding back' and contracting the PC/BC muscle right before ejaculating.
    So this was a very nice surprise.
    I really didn't give a very detailed description of what led up the the multiples. So here is another cut and paste from a PM of what happened first...
    The sex was spontanious first off. But she pulled my pants down and licked my penis and then began to rub her tit/tits on my 'hot spot' on the underside of my penis just below the head. Doing this I started having involuntaries to the point to where I was at the threshold of having multiples. I was so revved up that when I finally put her on her back and 'very slowly' inserted her, the first waves of O's were hitting. And I mean very slowly. As in first just resting my head on her lips and feeling the buzz. Then sliding in but taking maybe a full minute to get my penis even half way in. So the first waves of O's were hitting me before even barely penetrating her. For the most part I just stayed inserted but didn't fuck her like normal. As in I wasn't thrusting away or anything. I think this is a key element. I feel like too much stimulation in the beginning is what kills the internal feelings and transfers them mostly into your penis.
    But once the O's were hitting I found that I could thrust or penetrate much more without feeling like I was going to ejaculate. It's like once the internal O's begin, that there's no more worries of having to hold back though even still there was a few times during that session that I had to pull out for a second because I could feel that I was going to ejaculate but then I could continue on only seconds later with no problems.

    So I feel it's all about building arousal but with not too much stimulation. The way she was rubbing her tits on my hot spot wasn't like the same as if I was getting a hand job or full on oral. As in the stimulation was more of a arousal builder than something that would lead to an ejaculation. Then the feeling of sliding my penis into her was just what I needed to push me over the edge and begin the internal multiple orgasms.

    It's still all a learning experience because we had sex a couple days later and right away I could feel that there would be no multiples to be had. We didn't do enough arousing before penetration. Actually I was sort of on the verge of multiples before penetration but as soon as I penetrated her I could feel the energy shift and right away could feel the ejaculation reflex wanting to get involved. So after awhile of love making I decided to end it because I didn't want to ejaculate. Now that I've experienced what it's like to 'really' orgasm, It's hard to to settle for building arousal into one ejaculatory orgasm. Plus I feel by not ejaculating that next time we have sex, I'll have more energy to work with.




    We use this slow entry, still periods (where we both feels the energy exchanges; spontaneous and those generated at will by me), some sensual pumping, more still time, Os of all sorts and shifting focus to the gentlest longest build to mrs. a's G-spot and area filling and ejaculation followed by me growling and pumping through a string of Super-Os into the Super-T finale that Zaneblue notes and you are saving up for!

    We have found this works integrally with other "mental manipulation" as you you describe it, including some traditional Tantra and Taoist techniques, but particularly using the Key Sound at times to trigger, mostly to amplify and facilitate/direct the energy movement as we provide mental "openings" for it. We have earlier explored and progressed with Mantak Chia's approach to male and female cultivation to a modest degree.

    This post from the blog http://www.aneros.com/displayentry.php?id=269 describes the first time we reached, quite spontaneously from an open humble exploratory intent, the full Soul Mating set out in Chia's book The Multi-Orgasmic Couple. I think the von Urban cycle greatly assists in preparing our bodies for the dual orbit exchange from Taoist tradition. And it is "Beyond Words..." We are in the realm of Spiritual Orgasms here.

    These energies manifest in quite powerful ways for us. At times I can be caressing mrs. a's cheek, for example, and we both feel a fine bubbling electric froth tracing the way between her skin and mine, with a distinct afterglow. I recently added the post Sex and Death in the blog http://www.aneros.com/displayentry.php?id=412 which describes our extraordinary experience with my mother and her life force energies in the early stages of her death six years ago.

    The second segment of the post is from a Tao Bums thread about assisting and guiding to a degree the dying through their death; the role of the psychopomp. A psychopomp is either/or both/and "a guide of souls to the place of the dead" and/or "the spiritual guide of a living person's soul".

    The KS has been central in all of this for us. I agree with Pan and BF Mayfield on this point too in my/our experiences. :D

    Jack (KSMO) also has a practice he calls "Calmposting" the energies that you may find helpful as you progress. Learning to sense and "work" with the transmutation of the energies: orgasmic (jing) to> life force (chi) to> spiritual (shen) is also a key next step. Then there is sensing and storing yin chi and yang chi etc... 8)

    all the best to all as we here continue to explore these wonders

    artform
  • BusterBuster
    Posts: 953
    Hi Billy11, what a great journey you are on! One of real exploration instead of rushing to the finish. You have gotten some great feedback here so all I will just say that I believe that you should spend some more time with your KSMO practice. The "gentle caress" is used instead of direct, continual stimulation and what you will find is that these orgasmic sensations will build and build. Like all great things, it does take some time and practice.

    There is a chat over there today and you should get some one of one time with Jack. Be patient and wait your turn I am sure you will find it helpful.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,488
    Hi Buster. Right on!

    P.S. Billy11 and All

    I find we can rewire to completely by-pass erections, as others here also report. That can be an intentional focus, if a reluctant or daunting one for some. KS can be a key to this. I work with the prostate energy and all chakras without getting an ejaculatory erection.

    Now it can take time, a substantial mind-shift and physical stimulation to get an erection to masturbate and clean the pipes during a BPH therapy session. But not in the intentional shift from mutual prostate Super-Os to Super-T-ing with mrs. a!!!

    There are numerous threads here exploring these energies. The following is a quote from a post I made in the great (and related) Lurkish thread Tantra / First Super-O / Yoga Resources http://www.aneros.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3800&start=15 now on the current page 2 here in General Discussion:

    QUOTE>>>When Joni Mitchell wrote and sang: "We are stardust! We are golden! And we've got to get ourselves back to the garden...", she was in the first sentence speaking as both a poet and scientist! Our bodies are built of stardust literally. This cosmic reality spirituality is independent, and yet the foundation, of any creed, theism, or religion without altering or insulting the core of any faith. James P. Carse's book The Religious Case Against Belief is very helpful in this.

    We (and any other advanced life-forms) are, in a whole-body whole-being way, the universe making itself self-conscious and celebratory stardust reflecting upon itself and the wonder of it all.

    all the most vibrant electrical and quantum enlightening voyaging all <<<QUOTE<br />
    IMHO, that we can participate with intent, at will, with these energies means that this is not just something that happens to us as hapless "consumers" of orgasmic thrills, but rather this is something that calls us to our highest potential, to the best in us, to respond as if, in exploring and integrating these possibilities into the wholeness of our being, we are learning a core universal craft and art, and potentially creating/co-creating a masterpiece.

    Rumel & company, how about: The Aneros Massage Journey: From Masturbation to Masterpiece

    let me rephrase here,

    all the most resonant electro-chemical/electro-magnetic and quantum hive-mind enlightenment voyaging all

    artform
  • rumelrumel
    Posts: 2,265
    artform,

    Ashes to asses, stardust to Stardust, from super novas we came, to Super nOvas we return.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,488
    Too True R! :lol: :lol: :lol:

    To date 15 have responded to the first Spiritual Orgasm Poll: http://www.aneros.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3376 which also has a link to the Quest for Spiritual Orgasm article.

    Half have not had any such experience but are interested, the others varying degrees of attainment. Anyone care to add your vote?

    There is also the the second Spiritual Orgasm (Aneros/KSMO) Poll: http://www.aneros.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3378 where 4 have voted to date and 3 of them have the highest attainment. Anyone care to add your vote?

    How might we pursue this interest further here?

    ever curious

    artform
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    Thanks for your reply's Artform
    First reading about your first spiritual mutual orgasm is a fine read. Though it can be hard to put such an experience into words I think you did a fine job.
    I'm going to have to check out that book of the other link. The one called 'sexual energy ecstasy'.

    We use this slow entry, still periods (where we both feels the energy exchanges; spontaneous and those generated at will by me), some sensual pumping, more still time, Os of all sorts and shifting focus to the gentlest longest build to mrs. a's G-spot and area filling and ejaculation followed by me growling and pumping through a string of Super-Os into the Super-T finale that Zaneblue notes and you are saving up for!



    I've been using the slow entry technique for awhile now. I used to use it as a teasing mechanism when I was younger (well still do in a way). My favorite is to just set the head of my penis on the lips of her vagina and just leave it there for awhile as we're kissing or whatever it is we're doing. Just feeling our naughty parts buzzing away while doing this is awesome.

    Now days though I like to use the slow entry as a way to build and control arousal and pleasure. I feel for me that the slow insertion is going to be a key element for multiples because it's still just under enough stimulation to keep the arousal more internal. I find that often if I just plunge my way in there and go full speed ahead, that the sensations/pleasure/arousal can become over stimulated and actually kill the arousal level. Plus if during the course of sex I find myself becoming too desensitized, I'll slow way down and really focus on the pressure and sensations and this will bring the arousal levels back.

    When I was young there was no such thing as slow sex for me. It was all about hard and fast. Now days though I've found I enjoy slow sex very much. And the periods of stillness is key as well. I feel when I'm inside her but fully still is often when I'm having the most pleasure.
    What I find works very well is resting my head on her vagina lips for a bit, into a super slow insertion, and then stillness once inside for as long as I/We can stand. At this point the pleasure is intense being able to 'feel' her very well. Then super slow thrusting building the momentum more and more.
    Normally we'll shift from stillness to very slow thrusting to full throttle fucking many times during a session.

    I believe we've done the sciccors insertion like you described but I think this bends my penis in a way that's too distracting. I'll have to try that one out again to see.

    I find we can rewire to completely by-pass erections, as others here also report. That can be an intentional focus, if a reluctant or daunting one for some. KS can be a key to this. I work with the prostate energy and all chakras without getting an ejaculatory erection.



    I believe this as well. Every time we have sex the level of internal arousal grows more and more and the need to ejaculate less and less. Eventually I feel it won't matter whether I'm thrusting away or staying still as possible, I'll rewire to bypass the ejaculating.
    Another thing is that since I've started working with building my arousal levels as high as I can without getting an erection, is that my capacity for this has grown tremendously. What I mean is that before, the erection would come pretty fast but now I can get the arousal to the point to where I can feel it flowing through out my body from head to toes for awhile before it becomes too much and I get an erection. And when I do finally get an erection it's with an amazing force of energy. If I just intend for an erection it and get an erection without first building the internal arousal, it's like my penis almost feels numb now versus how sensitive and powerful the erection is after first building the arousal.
    Again thanks for your informative reply and links Artform. I'm going to have to read more of your blogs here and at the KSMO site.

    Bishop- I will work more with KSMO. It's difficult though in the aspect that I've been teaching myself on how to build this arousal so it's a bit hard to switch gears into using the KS. But I'm going to keep doing my aneroless sessions and do the KSMO for the recommended time a week. I really wish I would had learned KSMO at the beginning before the aneros and everything but what it is. I'm sure everything will come together.
    I really would had liked to make that chat but there was no way I could. Already had plans to go to a concert that night. I'm going to make every attempt to make the next one. I did read the chat from that night though. That always helps.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,488
    Bump for the benefit of the Stalled by Having Hands-Free Wet Ejaculatory Orgasms always in my Aneros Sessions discussion now going on in a number of threads!!! :idea: :idea: :idea:

    Thanks so much Billy11 for referencing this great thread in your post in gdbh2's thread on this topic!

    First Annual Highlights of the Year!

    Since this Februaury 2009 thread conversation, over this year mrs. a and I have found that as we developed the non-genital energies exchange abilities, those energies and the balancing are themselves a greatly joyous, profoundly bonding experience, and even if we are doing this in bed, we do not always need, want, look for a wet Super-T ending to our love-making!! :D :D

    Butt when it does want to happen, we fly with it gloriously as always!!! :lol: :lol: :wink:

    all the best energetics tracks and travel now and always all

    artform
  • Great thread. I wish to be in Billy's position of having hands free ejaculations. Instead what do I get? That's right multiple dry-O's. Dag gummit I so want to have a hands free ejaculation instead of wiring into super-O world. HAHAHA j/k


    I wouldn't give up the Super-O's for anything. While a hands free ejaculation would be nice I guess I can consider myself lucky that I can have multiple anerosless dry-o's. I really do attribute that success to the aneros. What's that thing i say all the time? Oh yeah... To be upset over what I don't have is to waste what I do have. :wink:

    I really would like to learn though how to go about using my mind for a hands free ejaculation. Am I going about this the wrong way? Is it just like the aneros and I can't have the goal of ejaculation in my mind? GAH!!!
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    Update on status-

    Posting in Korkelz poll http://www.aneros.com/forum/f6/what-happens-your-arousal-after-wet-dream-15614/
    I decided to go ahead and update this thread though some of the info I just posted there.

    Well unfortunately I can't say I've made much progress since I first posted this thread. But there's been some key things to note.

    Originally I was going to post a thread called "NIpple Play Has Ruined Me" but decided to just post it here.

    Since I discovered my nipples way back then and learned to have HFWO, I just can't seem to leave them alone. I've really lost the lust I once had for jacking off since then and would rather play with my nipples. It's amazing of how much hornier and excited I get from nipple play vs jacking off. The erection that comes from nipple play is so much more intense than if I started just playing with my dick. But this has been a major set back I would say to the path to MMO's and Super O's. Mainly because I never got over the hump of having HFWO's. For me the only way to have MMO's is to NOT play with/touch my nipples. Although it makes my prostate cum to life and really gets the energy moving, I accidentally wired them into ejaculation instead of dry o's/MMO's though the P waves are very pleasant to say the least. And over the last couple years the ejaculations I do have from nipple play have become extremely intense to the point to where I nearly "white out" (like black out but instead everything turns white) most the time during the ejaculation. It's just incredible. If there was no such thing as MMO's and Super O's I'd had thought I found the best way to pleasure yourself. But knowing there's so much more, instead it has because just as big of a road block as the lust for manually masterbating was.

    Like I posted in Korkelz thread, I never had my first wet dream until I was 29 after I learned to HFWO through nipple play and then just learning to mentally build arousal into ejaculation. Before that growing up as a kid and into my 20's I always woke from dreams having a dry O. It was awesome. I couldn't believe I could feel like I was having an ejaculation but not. It was like I was a preteen all over again lol. So I realized at one point the HFWO was not good for my rewiring so decided to give up nipple play as well as aneros and aneroless sessions to see if I could rewire myself back to try to rewire myself correctly again... confused yet lol. So I went back to traditional masterbation to see if I could rewire myself back. Well sure enough after some time I woke one night in what I thought was a wet dream but instead it was a Dry O. And from then on I was back to having Dry O dreams instead. I did manage to rewire myself back.

    But after some time I just couldn't help but start playing with the good ole' nipples again and basically repeated the process all over again and sure enough the wet dreams came back :-(.

    One thing though that I haven't mentioned yet. When I have these HFWO I don't have the same kind of refractory period like I would from traditional masterbation. If I do it right I can often masterbate right after cumming and jack off into a second ejaculation directly after words before my erection goes away. And if I don't do that I'm usually horny and ready to go within 20 minutes which usually never happens if I masterbate. So I've found that to be strange.

    A couple more things I've noticed which is not good-
    I feel like actual penis sensitivity has gone down. Since playing with nipples gets my prostate glowing, playing with my dick just doesn't feel all that great anymore. The only way it really feels good is after playing with my nipples for awhile and my prostate is already buzzing good.

    I'm not sure how much this is from aneros/aneroless sessions or just getting older... But in the last couple years I have this problem where I have a hard time keeping an erection during sex or even masterbation sometimes. I'm not sure but I think this is because of the waves of pleasure I'm used to having during the aneros/aneroless sessions. I go erect and flaccid with the waves. So when I'm having sex I feel like the same thing is happening. I feel I go through waves of pleasure and I'll lose or gain hardness with it. It's made for some awkward sex because I don't lose horniness but the penis just doesn't want to obey. Actually a big reason why I stopped doing nipple play awhile back other than to rewire myself away from HFWO's was because of this problem which I did feel helped the situation. But like I said I eventually fell back into the trap.

    Anyways not sure what to do. I'm a bit jealous of all the posters who love nipple play because it sends them into super O or MMO land. I love it too but for some reason it's wired me the wrong way twice now. Not sure where to go next. I can still MMO but it's like I find myself craving nipple play more. Like how many have a hard time being patient with the aneros because they want to play with their dick, I want to play with my nipples.

    Well at least it feels awesome but I know I'm short changing myself.