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Preventing those hand free ejaculations
  • wreckind
    Posts: 21
    Hello.

    While using the Aneros, how can you impeach the hand free ejaculation ?
    My two last sessions led me to these ejaculations (i had several dry orgasms during the sessions) when i felt the more intense sensations after 1 h 30- 2h.
    I would have preferred to let the feeling grow to an eventual spiritual orgasm.

    When you feel that it comes, what can you do to stop it and continue the session ?

    thanks in advance.
  • dtmsmith
    Posts: 219
    Are you avoiding all penile stimulation during your sessions? Assuming you are, then I don't have any advice for you. I have never had this issue; I have no urge to ejaculate unless I stroke myself. I am on the "older" side, so maybe this has something to do with it. I would be curious to find out how common hands free ejaculation is during an aneros session.
  • wreckind
    Posts: 21
    [QUOTE=dtmsmith;90516]Are you avoiding all penile stimulation during your sessions? Assuming you are, then I don't have any advice for you. I have never had this issue; I have no urge to ejaculate unless I stroke myself. I am on the "older" side, so maybe this has something to do with it. I would be curious to find out how common hands free ejaculation is during an aneros session.


    Yes. It occurs when i feel the most intense sensations that i know.
  • My last few sessions I have had this happen too, with no penis stimulation at all I will cum, which although Much more intense than a traditional orgasm and very pleasurable kind of puts an end to the session!
    It quite often happens if I am playing with my nipples, so maybe I'm just getting to excited and not keeping my concentration on my prostrate area.

    Would also be interested to hear of any thoughts on how to avoid this happening!
    :-)
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,474
    Hi wreckind, dtmsmith and goldenboyuk!!! :D :D :D :D

    A key topic this! This began to happen to me on occasion later in the development of my Aneros practice, butt takes me back to decades of Super-T-ing. I feel a definite intensification at/in my prostate as when I intend to Super-T. I agree with your description wreckind. Gbuk, added stim of various kinds, or even added desire/intention, can do this boost to the most intense prostate pump/squeeze/wiggle/buzz/lightning.

    Delicious as this sensation is, I learned to sense it early enough that I can intend to relax things at the prostate and rectal surround nerves system down just a notch, and continue drys and Super-O multiples as long as desired and physically capable before exhaustion! After first getting on to this, like the other "switches" in this orgasmic energetics system, you can then become the eroticist composer of your sessions to a degree, even though your body/mind will always be able to intervene with surprises or its old faves!

    As an ED ravaged older male, I love the switch to wet, when a wet finale is what mrs. a and I desire. Great when that is more difficult without deliberate intentional choice. This conscious switch does not always work, butt is often the key to getting up and over the hump.

    The degree of pressure on the prostate is also a factor we have determined when it is mrs. a's finger doing the massage. If I want to avoid the wet in an session, Eupho is my choice. If I want wet, Ice does it best, although my new Max has its own delights and can more easily go wet too.

    all the best desire intent wet dry and dry wet swtiching all

    artform
  • J4J4
    Posts: 124
    J4’s tips on avoiding the train wreck known as hands free wet orgasms:

    Do not move or thrust your hips as you reach peak sensations.
    If you are on your side or stomach, roll over to your back with knees up.
    Do not apply pressure to your pelvic area.
    Do not apply pressure to your perineum.
    If you are using an Aneros with a p-tab, switch over to a Peridise model. Since you can already produce dry o’s, the Peridise provides a much subtler path to pleasure.
    I also find taking a break in the middle of a session to provide a great change of pace. For instance, after 40 minutes of constant arousal building I will sometimes get up and fold laundry or have a cigar. 30 minutes later (give or take), when I lie back down, the sensations are all different and the involuntary muscle groups change.

    Many of us have wrestled with this hard wired pleasure path. Be thankful that you are able to have dry o’s. If your body learns to have HFWO first (like me), then you can be in for a much longer journey.

    Let us know what ends up working for you.

    J4
  • rookrook
    Posts: 1,603
    Early on in my introduction to the Aneros, I would get a streaming flow of semen (not precum) during nipple play while in a lotus position following removal of the tool. That reaction faded as my sessions moved on into less physically stimulating activities.

    Now I'm getting close to PONR-wet during some Peridise sessions.

    Possibly we're looking at how new activities that reach back to wet-orgasm wiring in the brain. If that's correct then, maintaining mental focus on the prostate should help alter this wiring.

    Perhaps posture and pressure in the lower pelvis has a lot to do with this "throwback" reaction. In the parallel thread -- http://www.aneros.com/forum/f5/just-keeps-getting-better-14752/ -- there's some related discussion.

    Remember that as far as the journey is concerned, "it's all good."
    ==== late edit ====
    Just got a look at J4's post. He says it well and those "prophylactic" measures have done well for me !!
  • Pan
    Posts: 249
    This is a key topic indeed.

    I had my first hands-free ejaculation about 4 years ago while using the Aneros. I fell into a series of dry O's/Super-O's that just kept building in intensity and frequency until the feeling of ejaculatory orgasm became continuous and eventually, semen began slowly pouring out of my flaccid, completely untouched and unstimulated penis in a long, incredibly powerful ejaculatory orgasm (I like to call these "Streaming Orgasms") that lasted perhaps 10-15 seconds. I could actually feel all of the surrounding muscles in the area involuntarily bearing down around my prostate and very slowly squeezing the fluid out in one long, deep contraction that seemed to last forever.

    But here's the problem, 4 years (and about a million Super-O's) later, my body has gotten so good at "bearing down" around my prostate that it's become an automatic reflex to almost instantly ejaculate when I become over-excited even without any physical stimulation whatsoever. It's as if I accidentally taught my body a new kind of PONR, one that is easily triggered by mental arousal alone.

    I agree with your advice J4, although I should mention my first HFWO happened while testing out the new Peridise models, so I'm afraid this type of re-wiring can happen with those models as well, it only seemed to slow the progression for awhile. Eventually my body was doing it without any external assistance at all, despite my best efforts to the contrary. Like J4 says, if you don't have this issue, be grateful. I long for the days before I had this particular "breakthrough" in my practice.

    I wish I knew more about this phenomenon. I only hope practitioners will continue to report in and share advice and experiences so we can build a solid knowledge base of techniques and methods that will hopefully lead us back out of this little orgasmic quagmire.

    My gut feeling is to ease up on the prostate massage (internal or external) and focus on my KSMO practice instead. I'm thinking I need some major re-re-wiring at this point in my practice, and (as usual) KSMO feels like the safest way to go about it. The only problem is I'm not quite healthy enough to do proper Key Sound practice these days. So for the time being, I have only a theory that re-learning KSMO might resolve this "bad wiring" issue, but I'm not yet in a position to test it out.

    I wonder if anyone else has tried re-learning KSMO as a possible long-term fix?

    Pan
  • Try taking J4's tip two a little further - lay on back and pull your knees towards your chest and hug your lower legs with your arms, so you are basically a ball shape and relax, visualise yourself as a light bulb that's just been switched on and dissipate the energy out evenly from your whole body, i.e. drawing it all away from feeling it is penile centred. If you really feel it just isn't going to stop, clamp down all your PC muscles and let the ejaculation spasms do their thing, stay in the position until they have died completely away and then slowly unfold your arms and legs, you will have lost most of the energy, but you should not have lost any semen.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,474
    Hey Pan!!

    I am sorry to hear both that your health is keeping you from using KSMO to address this unfortunate persistent hard-wired Streaming Orgasms response. Indeed, I have used KSMO to assist in detecting and rewiring for the best flexibility and intention choice with these nero-switches we all work with here.

    You are younger than I and perhaps my age and unreliable erection status is actually an advantage in this particular type of circuitry. My problem is the reverse, in that dry Calm Seas Orgasmic floating bliss (NO COMPLAINTS WHATEVER!!!) is the default mode my chronic pain wounded body clings to, and getting a wet orgasm short of vigourous hand/penis pumping is the problem here, that only more vigourous/fuller prostate massage can assist with strong intention working too.

    All the best for speedy health improvements Pan, my fellow wounded friend!! Back to KSMO asap! Also, given your range of complementary practices, please take a good look at Spring Forest Qigong: http://71.6.142.67/revize/sfq/index.htm

    Chunyi Lin, the SFQ Master, is used by the Mayo Clinic and very well regarded by medical doctors for his results in treating patients. I am studying his courses and successfully used his Sword Fingers technique on my recent bout of kidney stones and, more recently, in completely relieving the pain of a friend of ours awaiting surgery for an ovarian cyst. You may well be a natural at this too.

    all the best overcoming all our individual physiological impediments on our journeys all

    artform
  • Tremelo
    Posts: 141
    Hey, I've got a question for you guys experiencing the ejaculations.

    Do you find the semen just starts flowing out, or do you get the "kick" and then semen bursting out (as with a trad O)? My assumption has always been that it's the "kick" that causes the refractory period. Can you guys confirm this or rule it out?

    In the two years before I started with the Aneros, I was practicing edging to the extreme with my Fleshlights. And I'd gotten to the point where I could release *some* of my semen (with the corresponding heavenly sensation) withOUT "the kick," and thereby did not experience the refractory period. I got to the point where I could have three of those kickless partial releases before finally driving myself all the way home.

    So my lack of refractory period there owed either to a) not emptying my load completely, or b) preventing the kick, or c) both. How would your experiences illuminate me?
  • Pan
    Posts: 249
    Thank you for the suggestions hapticbear. I definitely think both you and J4 have the right idea here. I especially like your added visualizations. The light bulb symbol feels especially appropriate for this situation. LOL! What you guys are recommending is pretty much what I've been doing to stave off ejaculation once the reflexive urge to "bear down" has begun. But just as Jack teaches in KSMO, I think the best way to avoid a PONR is not to approach it in the first place. The trick is in finding a safe and effective alternate route and sticking to it until it gets ingrained (or perhaps in my case, re-ingrained). I think the same basic principle applies here.

    Hey Artform! I'm so glad to hear you've already had success using the Key Sound for a little custom re-wiring. That's exactly the kind of confirmation I was hoping to get from one of our established KSMO experts! Thank you for boosting my confidence a bit as I set out to reclaim my orgasmic birthright... ;)

    Actually, I can relate to your lack of wet orgasm difficulties as well. From the time I was teenager until well into my marriage (mid-20's), I often had difficulty achieving ejaculatory orgasm even after hours of vigorous intercourse or masturbation. It wasn't until I learned KSMO that I finally was able to "feel my way" to ejaculatory orgasm at will. Which I can assure you, has pleased my wife at least as much as the MMO's!

    I hesitate to suggest it but I can't help thinking, if I was able to "think my way" into HFWO's accidentally, I see no reason why you couldn't do it intentionally. I recall you mentioned having recent success with the Amygdala Clicking Feather Technique? I would actually compare this HFWO ability with learning that technique. It's a gradual process of specific physical awareness that eventually leads to specific physical reflexes. The upside is, just like riding a bike, once you have it, it's locked in. The downside also seems to be, once you have it, it's locked in. :S

    Your choice - the Blue Pill or the Red

    How far down the rabbit-hole do you wish to go...? ;)
  • Pan
    Posts: 249
    Hey Tremelo,

    I think you're right. For me, it's the "kick" that bring in the refractory period. I have had HFWO's with and without "kicks." Streaming Orgasms are totally seamless, no "kick" whatsoever. The first time I had one, I had a second "normal" spontaneous HFWO within 30 seconds of the first one. The second one had full contractions, squirting etc. It also felt incredibly pleasurable as it was totally unexpected and came right on the heels of the epic orgasm I had just had before it. So yeah, first HFWO - no kick lead straight into a second one with an amazing kick and then I was just in a refractory puddle for about 36 hours afterward. :)

    Although I started out with Streaming Orgasms, most of my HFWO's since then have all started with that "kick" and did indeed usually come with refractory periods. I also find it's far easier to intentionally have them with the kick rather than without.

    Hope this helps.
  • Key topic indeed!

    I am quite reassured to see I'm not alone to have this "problem" because it has been troubling me for a long time at the beginning of my journey since those hands free ejaculations were quasi systematic and killed almost all of the sessions. I felt stuck to this point for a long time.

    With time, I tried to identify the premices of these ejaculations and managed to at least delay them. I don't know if it makes sense but just before I have those HF ejaculation I feel the aneros make larger movement until it's pushed a little downward and hit a specific point which i should call "the point of non return". So I try to stop any movement when I feel the aneros is moving the "wrong" way.

    I definitely agree with your first 2 advices J4 : Most of my wet HFWO occur when i lay on my side or due to large hips movements. Its a hard thing for me to avoid these large hips movement since it's something not really controllable.

    Other tips which seemed to help me on my journey and reach (and stay into) the O'zone is relaxation which help me to stay still (and focus on my prostate) and use more lube which seems to help the aneros moving by itself with limited movements of myself.
    I'm not sure all of this is really correlated to the prevention of HFWO but it's some of the steps I have identified in my journey and now I have almost no HFWO during sessions.
  • J4J4
    Posts: 124
    I agree with so much about what is being written here. HFWO are very alluring and, for me, caused a lot of confusion. I had my first HFWO during my first week of Aneros use. It was all the proof I needed that there was magic in the plastic.

    Sometime later I was able to reproduce the HFWO’s while having some fun on an exercise ball. I was convinced I was having dry o’s with a lot of “fluid”. Later on I could achieve a HFWO on my back while thrusting or applying just a little bit of pressure on my pelvis at the right time. These kinds of orgasms felt strange and wonderful – they were prostate stimulated instead of frenulum stimulated. I could have as many as 4 or 5 fantistic dry orgasmic pumps before I began to ooze out the real thing.

    Tremelo, as for the refractory period, that was again alluring and confusing. It was like having “half-gasms”. I could have a full fantastic orgasm without touching myself and then I could stimulate myself to a traditional orgasm within minutes of having a HFWO. For a while I experimented with HFWO edging, hoping to trigger the dry spasms without any fluid release. I had to abandon this approach as the HFWO was becoming unwontedly hardwired into my pleasure circuit. Certainly a fun trick, but not where I wanted to go.

    I know there are those amongst us who can switch pleasure circuits and I am sure there are those amongst us who have the ability to stop there body from going all PONR at the wrong time. I have also read threads of people who envy those of us who have the ability to HFWO.

    I do not recommend the path of the HFWO for those who have not learned to separate orgasm from ejaculation.

    Pan has great a recommendation in utilizing KSMO. KSMO has helped me keep going when the Aneros couldn’t push me any further.

    Good discussion here.

    J4
  • Tremelo
    Posts: 141
    Hey guys, thanks for your clarifications.

    Ironically (to how confusing this all can be), I had a hands-free kick beyond any prior experience this afternoon - I cried out so loudly and suddenly that I'm sure anyone home in my apt building heard me - but it WAS dry. Afterward, I felt more contented than I ever had after an Aneros session. Was it a refractory period? I dunno. Felt like I could have continued, but absolutely no real desire to do so (and I had other things to do anyway).

    We are exploring powerful and arcane forces.
  • Some other things to try:

    (a). Before you are anywhere near PONR, pulse your muscles in a mock ejaculate action, for say 10 times, to fatigue that particular muscle sequence and 'fool' the "kick" trigger that it has already happened.

    (b). Pan this is from you mentioning the 'Amygdala Clicking Forward Feather Tickling Visualisation Technique' - I was half asleep early this morning pondering, that you don't have to be locked into anything, we seem very malleable creatures and then I began visualising myself as a giant penis, this is an easy scale up, look at your balls and cock and then see yourself cross-legged (balls) and your torso and head (cock shaft and cock head), now visualise that you are instead of stimulating your cock head you are stimulating your larger scale brain (scaled up cock head) - centre the stimulation on the frontal cortex. To help transfer the energy and ground the imagery, momentarily actually touch the underside of your cock head with one middle finger and touch the point just between your eyebrows on your forehead with your other middle finger tip. Then say to yourself I don't wish to ejaculate but wish to experience full body orgasm.
  • Pan
    Posts: 249
    Thanks hapticbear,

    I gotta say, I like your style. From your posts, I think we have a very similar approach to self-hypnosis. It just so happens that I also have imagined myself to be a giant penis on many occasions and I've always found it to be quite stimulating! ;)

    But in all seriousness, I really like your symbolic approach here - with the tip of the penis placed at the Third Eye or Crown Chakra level, that imagery at least to me, suggests a powerful message to the subconscious that the genitals are only the beginning of orgasmic pleasure and ultimate "release" resides in the higher energy centers, above and beyond mere ejaculation. I've used a similar visualization during many of my sessions to encourage the Kundalini flow through all of my chakras. But I totally agree it's well suited for this issue. I also like how you included additional senses - touch and hearing (from speaking the affirmation aloud). The more senses you add, the more you re-affirm the importance of this issue to the subconscious mind. It makes for more of a complete ritual/hypnotic suggestion in my opinion. I'm definitely going to use this as part of my re-re-wiring process. Thanks for posting it! :)

    I don't know if you're interested in NLP, but your visualization approach reminds of a technique called the VAK Swish pattern described here: The Swish Pattern by Tim Mackesey

    It combines one's Visual, Auditory, and Kinesthetic senses (VAK) with a simple form of self-hypnosis. I've been using it with great success on a wide variety of issues, but I think it could also be helpful for those of us in need of re-wiring. I just started applying it to my HFWO issues recently, but I have already noticed a general improvement in my sessions (Aneros or otherwise) overall. I'm finding myself able to relax and simply enjoy the feelings more, as well as noticing my body seems to be spontaneously choosing Dry O's over the HFWO's with more frequency. I feel that the more I use it, the more it helps. But I'd love to hear what an experienced hypno-explorer like yourself could do with a technique like this. After all, the technique is rooted in one's own imagination and something tells me that your imagination could do a LOT with this technique. ;)

    Pan
  • My favorite Aneros is still the MGX even though I own every model. If I am not careful I cum when I put myself into the "crunches" position. This is one of the most pleasurable acts I've ever experienced.
    I have discovered if I feel an orgasm about to occur if I immediately "lay flat" on my back and squeeze the base of my penis I can prevent the orgasm. The key is catching it early and not stopping the squeeze until I am certain I have stopped/delayed it.
    I, too, am older but I love it! I welcome the changes that come with age.
  • [QUOTE=arkfarmbear;90842]My favorite Aneros is still the MGX even though I own every model. If I am not careful I cum when I put myself into the "crunches" position. This is one of the most pleasurable acts I've ever experienced.
    I have discovered if I feel an orgasm about to occur if I immediately "lay flat" on my back and squeeze the base of my penis I can prevent the orgasm. The key is catching it early and not stopping the squeeze until I am certain I have stopped/delayed it.
    I, too, am older but I love it! I welcome the changes that come with age.

    Be warned that can result in retrograde ejaculation if you fire anyway, forcing the ejaculate into the bladder, where it is not supposed to be. This can lead to infection. It certainly works with stopping the ejaculation and, because your body senses it didn't actually fire the semen, it'll not force you into refractory, but there is a risk involved.
  • I could not help but stroke my cock after my first experiance....I was cumming loads of pre and I was confused as to what was pre, it all tatsted the same! I kept rubbing it on my cock and wow!