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Men that get pleasure NOT from pleasuring their woman
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    Hi, Sorry for this rushed post but I need to get it out, even if I can't articulate it properly and come off like I should be committed:

    I have a lot of sexual and sexuality (not knowing mine) issues, and my main quest here was sexual pleasure. I don't get any/much during penile stimulation - not until orgasm. See my signature.

    I have developed a (new) obsession where I won't be happy unless I can get as much pleasure as a woman (G spot, multiple orgasm, moaning, etc) which is evident (the moaning, which men only do during orgasm, so men's orgasm = how sex is for woman throughout, right? While female orgasm = men have no idea of the pleasure), and seems reasonable (how can orgasm after orgasm not be pleasurable, esp when laying on your back letting the man take care of it).


    Another "facet" of this obsession is that men get pleasure from SEEING and GIVING pleasure to their woman, yet women not so much - women usually get pleasure from RECEIVING pleasure.

    Am I transgenered SEXUALLY (not emotionally)? It seems straight guys get pleasure from pleasuring; women get pleasure from being pleasured - I want pleasure from the feeling of getting pleasure. Not from watching a girl's eyes roll back or moaning. It's a turn-on until my OCDish mind/reasonable mind? gets hold of it and says: "you deserve THAT extent of pleasure too", then anxiety and mysogyny sets in.

    I don't want my pleasure to be based on PLEASURING someone else. So in that respect, I can't understand heterosexual men. I dunno if gay men are the same. Something tells me they are more out for their own pleasure (sorry to sound offensive. Shoot, I dunno my sexuality and might be bisexual or gay).

    Women can close their eyes during sex and focus on the pleasure they get.
    Men are looking at the woman imagining the woman's pleasure, getting pleasure from giving woman pleasure that they themselves (the man) would never experience. To me that's ..well, let's just say, not my thing.


    Women can enjoy sex with a silent man. Men can't enjoy sex with a silent woman. Women have their eyes closed enjoying, men are always looking at the woman until their poor short single penile orgasm comes along.

    Are there men here that get pleasure PURELY from the sensations in their body? Or is a man's pleasure just some transitive, pseudo sympathy-pleasure (like "sympathy pains", feeling the pains of a pregnant woman/your wife although you are a man), vicariously lived via their girl?

    I am seeing a physchologist, coz my mind won't let me rest til I can acheive the pleasure of a woman (determinable by uncontrollable moaning). Time's up. I gotta go. Thx for reading.

    Sorry for offending/belittling anyone.
  • South7856
    Posts: 40
    Whoa....that was deep...yo i don't think your crazy....i know exactly wat you mean. i have thought about the same thing just.....not as deep as you. but i could never explain it as good as you. it does to me seem like the woman gets the better end of things...like you say.
  • PolecatPolecat
    Posts: 56
    MyTurn and South7856,

    Your comments seem pretty reductionist to me. Women get the better end of the deal? Women don't really enjoy pleasuring men ? First I would say that it depends on the woman! Second, I would say that some women often feel the same way about men.. that their enthusiasm about sex is limited to what they (men) can get out of it and not much more (then they roll over and fall asleep). Surely you've both heard about comments like these before?

    These are NOT truisms! They're basically gripes that stem from dysfunctional relationships between men and women. MyTurn, there looks to be some very deep stuff going on with you, far more than can be adequately addressed or resolved in a forum for a prostate massage device. I think that this forum may be of help to you in the future, but it really looks like you have some things to clear through first. If anything, this place celebrates male sexuality as it looks to expand it's boundaries. The manner in which you are obsessively coveting female sexuality is non-productive, not in the best spirit of this forum and is frankly a bit disturbing.

    Your joy and pleasure in life needn't be tied up in what others have. Doing so is a sure road to misery. Hopefully your psychologist will help you discover this.

    Take care,

    Paul
  • South7856
    Posts: 40
    LOL!!! CALM DOWN.....Polecat.....and yo i don't want this to turn into a written argument...all i ment was i understand wat he is saying and i have thought along those lines before just i never broke it down and analized it that far...I also agree with points from your perspective...and there have been off topic posts made in this forum before as you may know...
  • Love_isLove_is
    Posts: 1,672
    Hello MyTurn , :)

    You've set some very rigid perceptions of sex, pleasure, and gender in your head, that I believe do not help you at all. I think you need to separate the idea that pleasure is individual to gender. And then you need to open your mind to the idea that there are all kinds of people out there of both genders that experience pleasure in all sorts of ways. I can see how you base a lot of this on the sexual experiences you have with your current girlfriend and the way you perceive her to experience pleasure. But that's only one way of seeing things. Not every woman you will have sex with in your life will respond in, or be the same way about sex and pleasure.

    For example, I've known and been with women that get pleasure from giving and seeing pleasure to their partners, in addition to receiving it. And as a male, I am capable of receiving pleasure purely from the sensations in my body. But just doing that is so one sided, and for me at least, not very fulfilling when you don't include all of the many other aspects. So why stop there?There is much more to sex and sexual pleasure than just the physical aspect. This has been talked about quite a bit here in the forum in terms of Aneros usage. Here's the most recent thread.

    http://www.aneros.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4096

    Have you ever heard the phrase, "The largest sex organ in the human body is your brain"? Look up that phrase in a search engine, and read some of the results.

    It's a good thing to remember. The older I get, the more that phrase rings true with me. What's going on in your head as far as thoughts, has a lot more to do with arousal, and pleasure than many people give it credit.

    You know, I find that when you obsess about something, you not only are narrowly and intensely focused on it. But have setup some rigid expectations of how you think things are supposed to be. So you completely overlook and miss other solutions, or ways of looking at things. And in the process, you just you make yourself miserable when things don't go the way you expected them to. Or you just wonder why life hands you a shit sandwich every time you are hungry. I know this from personal experience. As I struggle with obsessing about things at times also.

    You need to find a way to let this stuff go. And just allow yourself to journey through and experience life and the myriad of pleasures it can provide. The universe has a mysterious way of bringing answers and experiences into our lives when we relax and allow them to come to us.

    Love_is
  • PolecatPolecat
    Posts: 56
    South7856 said:

    LOL!!! CALM DOWN.....Polecat.....and yo i don't want this to turn into a written argument...all i ment was i understand wat he is saying and i have thought along those lines before just i never broke it down and analized it that far...I also agree with points from your perspective...and there have been off topic posts made in this forum before as you may know...




    South7856,

    I'm not trying to argue either, nor am angry at anyone. Really, I was just expressing my concern that (IMHO) there is some unhealthy thinking going on here, that's all. It also occurred to me that MyTurn's interests would be best served by looking elsewhere for answers to some of the questions that he has.

    And yes, it did look like you were cosigning some of what was being said. I get now that you weren't looking that far into it. Also, just to be clear, I wasn't saying that his comments were off-topic per se, just that they were not in the best spirit of what this forum is about. I think that there would be few people here whose main interest is to have superior sexual potential to females, just for it's own sake.


    Paul
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    Polecat said:

    MyTurn and South7856,

    Your comments seem pretty reductionist to me. Women get the better end of the deal? Women don't really enjoy pleasuring men ? First I would say that it depends on the woman! Second, I would say that some women often feel the same way about men.. that their enthusiasm about sex is limited to what they (men) can get out of it and not much more (then they roll over and fall asleep). Surely you've both heard about comments like these before?
    l



    Yes. So women may be limited by their men, but men are limited by...genetics, biology? Much harder to overcome.

    Polecat said:



    These are NOT truisms! They're basically gripes that stem from dysfunctional relationships between men and women. MyTurn, there looks to be some very deep stuff going on with you, far more than can be adequately addressed or resolved in a forum for a prostate massage device. I think that this forum may be of help to you in the future, but it really looks like you have some things to clear through first. If anything, this place celebrates male sexuality as it looks to expand it's boundaries.



    I know, but with such an obsessive mind, it's hard for me to say "ah well, never mind. Men don't need as much pleasure". The whole reason I'm here is to address that imbalance, especially for myself, who is "more imbalanced" (in so many ways) than most men because I feel I get the least out of it, although reading about one or two guys that have sexual adhedonia (sp?) does make me feel slightly less...destitute, hopeless.

    I hope (probably backwards in some people's eyes) that by celebrating and enjoying male (my) sexuality, I can clear through this "block", obsession, dysfunction.

    Polecat said:



    Your joy and pleasure in life needn't be tied up in what others have. Doing so is a sure road to misery. Hopefully your psychologist will help you discover this.



    True, but when I see "great", I want it for myself. I think I deserve it.

    Thanks for your comments.
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    Polecat said:

    I think that there would be few people here whose main interest is to have superior sexual potential to females, just for it's own sake.


    Paul



    Not just for its own sake. Do you know how hurtful it is for your girlfriend to say: that was amazing - and you not have a CLUE what she experienced? I do, and I feel DISCONNECTED to her during those times. WHen she is moaning in bliss, I feel like walled off from her. I am unaware of her intense pleasure. I cannot relate.

    I want to. This is not for its own sake at all.
  • darwindarwin
    Posts: 1,193
    MyTurn-

    the main message that polecat is delivering is this: this forum is not the place for you to attempt to address your problems. you will not find your answers here. your answers lie in your work with mental health professionals.

    darwin
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    Love_is said:

    Hello MyTurn , :)

    For example, I've known and been with women that get pleasure from giving and seeing pleasure to their partners, in addition to receiving it. And as a male, I am capable of receiving pleasure purely from the sensations in my body.

    Love_is



    That's good to know. A big part of this is my current inability to experience pleasure (unlinked to orgasm), so for me, it seems very bleak, and I tend to be very rigid and obsessive over this, because it is scary, the prospect of a pleasureless life. If the best pleasure is denied someone, you can see the toll it would take on his mind.

    Love_is said:

    Hello MyTurn , :)

    Have you ever heard the phrase, "The largest sex organ in the human body is your brain"? Look up that phrase in a search engine, and read some of the results.

    It's a good thing to remember. The older I get, the more that phrase rings true with me. What's going on in your head as far as thoughts, has a lot more to do with arousal, and pleasure than many people give it credit.

    Love_is



    True, and I have been hearing that a lot, even from a doctor. So I need a new brain then, coz my penis and urology is probably fine. I still feel that my testosterone is weak but the docs said it is "average". So they said.

    Love_is said:



    You need to find a way to let this stuff go. And just allow yourself to journey through and experience life and the myriad of pleasures it can provide. The universe has a mysterious way of bringing answers and experiences into our lives when we relax and allow them to come to us.

    Love_is



    The scary thing is, it would be easy to let this go if it were SOLVED. I could MOVE ON. WHo likes QUITTING? . GIVING UP on this is not so easy, especially with my obsessive personality and mind. And it is important to me too. I feel I deserve pleasure after such a shitty teenhood and early adulthood (not to say others haven't had their own problems, etc), but since I've not been suicidal these past few months, I thought my newfound positivity (ok, it needs work!) would reward me. I thought I could get out of life what I put in. I want out of life what I put in. Not some mediocre worklife, then terminal illness then dead and forgotten. I want some GOOD, some PLEASURE before I turn into a corpse.

    And not pleasure from seeing other's. Not from trying to wean it out of some arty activity or walks in the countryside, but from this COMPLEX BODY that I own. AFAIK it is in working order, so why can't I reap benefits from its being in working order? That's my question.

    Thanks Love_Is.

    Sorry for upsetting the forum. I will try to keep my problems to a limited number of threads (those that I started). Thanks mods for bearing with me.
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    darwin said:

    MyTurn-

    the main message that polecat is delivering is this: this forum is not the place for you to attempt to address your problems. you will not find your answers here. your answers lie in your work with mental health professionals.

    darwin



    Sorry for being rigid and bombarding you all with this. It must not be fun to read if you are here for prostate info, not someone's sexual and mental problems, but I am crying out for help and welcome it from anyone willing to drop their 2c or 2p in here for me. I don't mean to offend or troll. I just have a hard time coping with all of this. It is a lot to realize about oneself.
  • wohdin
    Posts: 42
    Okay, let me explain a few things - firstly, I would sexually consider myself of the homosexual variety, considering I typically only get physically aroused by the thought of another man, but I would typically consider myself pansexual, due to the fact that I'm about 100% bottom, and could really "have sex" with anything that could top me, whether it be a male or a female with a strap-on or whatever, but my primary concern when it comes to sex is the intimacy of the relationship, to be able to feel completely comfortable with the other person. And another contradiction is in the perspective of "giving versus taking" that you're examining in that I'm not quite either; I have more of a "submission complex" where I can't enjoy sex unless I somehow subconsciously feel that I am being used physically for the other person's sexual gratification. (This very well may be the biggest hurdle by far for me to overcome in using the Aneros, but that's for a different thread entirely. And yes, I know that this is probably unhealthy, but that's not the point.) Not everyone - and probably fewer than you think - will actually fit into this sort of "give/take" binary that you seem to believe is so dominant in human sex.

    It also sounds to me like you're too caught up in solely the pleasure derived from the sex act between two individuals, when in reality there are far more competing elements to it. The physical attraction, the emotional bond. Whether you actually have a romantic love for your partner. Auxilary elements play into the male sex just as they do the female's - and honestly, one could argue that as man, we are luckier in the "pleasure" aspect, simply because we are more likely to be able to seperate "sexual gratification", as in a standard penile orgasm, from the emotional aspects of sex, whereas women are far less capable of doing so in general; there are women who go their entire lives without EVER experiencing a conscious orgasm! And to me, that's more tragic than any sort of "pleasure ripoff" than what some men believe we suffer from.

    While men, just as women, have all the necessary tools in their body and mind to achieve that sort of "emotional" orgasm that you seem to seek, they are far less likely to attain them because of not only biological predispositions, but the reinforced masculinity of society as well. We are DIScouraged from having this kind of response, because it is deemed "feminine" and therefore would "damage our manhood." If you're looking for something to blame for your inability to attain the "uiltimate pleasure" then blame society; but my suggestion is to not blame anyone - instead, open your mind, retreat from the universe that tells you that "penis = pleasure," do some soul searching, learn more about what the words "pleasure" and "ecstasy" really means, learn more about what it is that you want from life, learn more about sex, disband from your masculinity and your doubts in favor of neutrality, discover who you are, and more importantly than anything, look outside of yourself, because until you do, you will never unlock the doors to true enlightenment. Much like the Aneros, learning anything new about your own sexuality or spirituality is all about the journey; it's about losing yourself, about finding things you weren't even seeking, and learning more and more every inch along the way, because you will stumble upon your answers the moment that you truly forget what it is you were seeking and lose yourself in the ocean of flowers (or whatever other fruity metaphor for "mindscape" you want to throw in here lol).
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    wohdin. thanks for that. since I'm short on time, one thing stands out about your post: about wanting to be "used" and the "submission complex". I, in part, have that - or have a fantasy about it, or find it would allow me to do the relaxing during sex - however, AFAIK or at the moment, I am only interested in having sex with the opp. sex, and I'm not about to suggest a strap-on and get cussed - I'd much rather see a prostitute woman with a strap-on, who is paid to "do her job" and keep her comments to herself.

    Kinda offtopic, sorry, but I take on board your comments.

    However, some people - nicknamed "sluts", "easy", "hedonists", "freelovers", "open" - are able to separate sex from love and all the other mental and emotional connections - they just do it for pleasure - so what about THEM?
  • OH!!
    Posts: 260
    I don't know if I totally agree with your assertions on how men / women generally derive pleasure but to some extent I do and know what you are referring to. Keep in mind any of that is a generality as there are varying degrees of pleasure that men in traditional mode and women receive.

    I absolutely get the intense pleasure that you describe. My orgasms are probably stronger than most women. However not being female I can't confirm that. Probably the orgasmic feeling I get may be different than women, but it is probably very similar. I don't necessarily agree that it is related to level and volume of moaning. Initially using the Aneros I was very loud. However I had to constrain myself so my neighbors outside and other members of my family would not hear me when they were in the house. This was difficult at first and still is at times, but often I am quiet - holding in the intense orgasmic pleasure. Perhaps that even concentrates it more.

    My experience is uncontrollable shaking with a simultaneous extremely pleasurable euphoria feeling flooding my body is a true sign of true orgasm. Most of us have sessions where we spasm some, legs shaking, etc with pleasurable feelings but IMO that is not true orgasm or true 'super O'. True orgasm feels like an uncontrollable release flooding your body after you have reached a plateau. Your body takes over involuntarily shaking. My whole body shakes during orgasm and it goes on for 5 to 25 minutes at a time - each cycle. It is wonderfully bliss when it happens so - yeah worth working toward. Also I have found that I cannot stop or control the shaking unless I remove the Aneros and get up. The other day I was thinking - maybe I am just making this happen, but I tried to will the spasms and orgasm to stop and I could not and could not control my body. It was almost like a seizure or something. It was cool cause I could look in a disassociated way and observe and be amazed as I watched it continue almost like a spectator, but I could also feel the sensations. I was also looking at my legs and noticed that all the muscles were activating in a way that I would have a very difficult or almost impossible way for them to contract - all around in different parts of my legs simultaneously.

    I know when you consider the traditional sex role of a male and their penis with a partner it seems limited...but that is what all the talk on here is about. I've found I can orgasm with the Aneros, or Peridise, or by pressing below the base of the penis steadily, or in the P-spot, or K-spot, or by rubbing my nipples, or even without stimulating anything but using my mind to bring myself to full arousal (although that is slower and more difficult).

    You can get some of that pleasure in sessions with a woman or sex partner. I've experimented to some degree and success but for me it is much easier alone. Maybe it could be better with two people especially if your partner is super hot but it requires a certain togetherness and sharing in the relationship I'd say.

    Reading all the problems guys have with full orgasms on this site, and all the problems I see that women have with orgasm on Zane's old site (many women can't orgasm) I still believe as researchers have stated that orgasm is centered in the brain. It requires the proper functioning and chemistry in the brain to be present in order to have and maximize orgasms. Some people do not have what it takes for one reason or another. Over time and experimentation I am learning that I am very blessed.

    I will say that it's kind of lonely road though. My orgasmic experiences are ultra crazy intense - almost like I am tasting another dimension but I can't really share it or even explain that well to other people. I suspect I can't tell my guy friends as I would be teased as gay, and my wife doesn't have orgasms like that and we aren't always that close so she doesn't really know or understand. So, it is something private I carry and feel very lucky to have, but also feel a bit alone in it. I suppose that is one reason these forums are good. I think there are other members here that share a similar level as mine - though perhaps not too many. I'll also say it's a bit of a burden because the siren lures you to come experience bliss once more again and again and it takes time away from other things. It's almost like a drug addiction. Also after an hour or 2 I am so worn and and relaxed I tend to just blow off daily activities or exercise, etc I needed to do. So like I say a bit of a burden. It is something I need to try and maintain control over, but it is tough.

    I wish you could feel what I describe. I think I have made suggestions to you before. Sure it is a difficult road to walk and understand. You can't get too caught up and what you see or your expectations. You have to be open, patient, and willing to try different things and explore your body over time. Personally I think some of the supplements I take and a bit of the semen retention helps some as well. When my brain is primed to orgasm I will even start to do it just lying in bed trying to sleep and not doing anything to stimulate myself. It can be just like that. Condition your body / brain - not just your mind. Also, be careful for what you ask for as you just might get it.
  • OH!!
    Posts: 260
    Let me add that you mentioned you were suicidal in the past. I'm sorry to hear that. I lost one of my best friend's to suicide. Life can be complex and difficult. Everyone's brain chemistry isn't proper and causes problems. Our addictions - drugs, alcohol, smoking, etc can mess that up. Life challenges / situations can be disappointing and condition your brain for failure setting up that organic state in your brain. Many of us at times are depressed... So, I wish you the best. Take care, and seek help and friends, and support. I know God / religion is looked down upon it seems nowadays but I believe that personal relationship can lead you through many closed doors - so keep an open mind there as well. Take care......
  • MyTurn
    Posts: 447
    [quote=OH!!]
    I absolutely get the intense pleasure that you describe. My orgasms are probably stronger than most women. However not being female I can't confirm that. Probably the orgasmic feeling I get may be different than women, but it is probably very similar. I don't necessarily agree that it is related to level and volume of moaning. Initially using the Aneros I was very loud.


    Hi, although I was not talking about orgasm alone, but the sensations before it, the sensations from sex, etc - if you have sensations that could be described as "orgasmic" or comparable with orgasm even before that stage, then that is encouraging, and I thank you for sharing.

    What is it about orgasms that make men and women moan, and what is it about sex-sensations that make woman moan, and men silent, then? If moaning isn't related to pleasure, why is the man's climax a cause for moaning?

    [quote=OH!!]
    True orgasm feels like an uncontrollable release flooding your body after you have reached a plateau. Your body takes over involuntarily shaking. My whole body shakes during orgasm and it goes on for 5 to 25 minutes at a time - each cycle.


    I hope I can get there. It doesn't have to be right now, but I want to get there. I am willing to be patient and try whatever I can. That restores some of my "faith" in men not being a "weaker" sex (sexual-pleasure potential wise).

    [quote=OH!!]
    Reading all the problems guys have with full orgasms on this site, and all the problems I see that women have with orgasm on Zane's old site (many women can't orgasm) I still believe as researchers have stated that orgasm is centered in the brain.


    "Many"? That is changing. I think that in this generation of teens, they (girls) are more aware of orgasms, more demanding, less willing to put up with an orgasmless relationship, so this number will fall. I've been on medical forums and seen women in their 40's have their first orgasm.

    Soon, the only women not having orgasms will be the few (1%?) anorgasmic ones.

    [quote=OH!!]
    I will say that it's kind of lonely road though. My orgasmic experiences are ultra crazy intense - almost like I am tasting another dimension but I can't really share it or even explain that well to other people. I suspect I can't tell my guy friends as I would be teased as gay, and my wife doesn't have orgasms like that and we aren't always that close so she doesn't really know or understand. So, it is something private I carry and feel very lucky to have, but also feel a bit alone in it.


    It must be great to have this "plumbing" without the need for an anal taboo toy - i.e. women have it built-in and can share it with their man from the getgo. Where Aneros is largely a solo-pleasure tool, women have it with the emotional connection built-in. I would love to see a time when it is not a taboo for heteros. If I ever get to Super-O, I will introduce it to whatever hetero relationship I'm in, coz I feel I could communicate the intense pleasure, and be convincing (or leave the relationship). Right now, I'm just a guy with plastic in his ass.

    [quote=OH!!]
    Sure it is a difficult road to walk and understand. You can't get too caught up and what you see or your expectations. You have to be open, patient, and willing to try different things and explore your body over time. Personally I think some of the supplements I take and a bit of the semen retention helps some as well.


    I think I remember a PM from you. I will check it now. Can you remind me what you advised? At the mo, I am taking Omega 3 fish oil, kegeling, and working my way up on both of these. The last two sessions, I have felt some slight hints of a nice feeling, which is a start. I hope it gets better though.

    [quote=OH!!]
    So, I wish you the best. Take care, and seek help and friends, and support. I know God / religion is looked down upon it seems nowadays but I believe that personal relationship can lead you through many closed doors - so keep an open mind there as well.


    Thanks. I do believe in God (although many times I look at starving macheted-up refugees in Asia/Africa and reason that if they don't get help, why would I for my depression - note: I said that during my other problems, not my sexual ones. I wouldn't expect God to consider anything "sexual" to be a problem, other than not being able to have children.

    Sorry for rushing this post. I am seeing if my rel with my gf is worth saving. Dating a MOTHER was a bad idea for me. sigh....
  • Love_isLove_is
    Posts: 1,672
    Hello again MyTurn, :)

    What is it about orgasms that make men and women moan, and what is it about sex-sensations that make woman moan, and men silent, then? If moaning isn't related to pleasure, why is the man's climax a cause for moaning?


    Moaning is one of many responses to pleasure. Not the other way around as you imply. That's where your focus is off. Everybody responds to the feeling of pleasure in different ways. There are men and women out there that never make any noise during sex or masturbation. It doesn't mean they aren't enjoying it, or are not orgasming. Although in my experience you miss out on a lot by withholding responses to pleasure. Besides the fact that if you are with a partner, it's arousing to hear, and gives you some cues as to whether you are pleasuring them or not. Assuming they don't verbally tell you.

    Right now, I'm just a guy with plastic in his ass.


    At least you still have your sense of humor. :lol:

    The last two sessions, I have felt some slight hints of a nice feeling, which is a start. I hope it gets better though.

    It will. Be patient. :)

    I wouldn't expect God to consider anything "sexual" to be a problem, other than not being able to have children.

    And why not? Your sexuality and sexual response are a part of your body and experience here. Don't let the dogma of religious beliefs keep you from feeling spiritual freedom and discovering and accepting every part of who you are.

    I am seeing if my rel with my gf is worth saving. Dating a MOTHER was a bad idea for me. sigh....

    It's good that you are contemplating if there is anything of worth in your relationship, and if things can be salvaged between you and her. But placing the blame on her for being a mother is a bad idea. She is who she is, regardless of whether she is a mother or not.

    Love_is