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I'm not sure if I truly know what an Orgasm is
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    I know the title sounds a bit strange, but bear with me for a moment.

    Obviously I know what a traditional penile orgasm feels like. Or more specifically, the traditional penile combination of orgasm and ejaculation.

    However, I'm not entirely sure which feelings are related individually to orgasm or ejaculation.
    I feel that I've been making quite good progress with my aneros sessions, but I don't think I've had any dry-, mini- or super-orgasms yet.
    I've had a whole range of pleasurable sensations and even involuntary muscle contractions and breathing patterns, but nothing that has been quite as intense as a "traditional orgasm".
    I'm wondering if maybe I've got false expectations, or if I simply haven't reached the orgasmic potential of my journey yet.

    From what I've read, some of the feelings that I associate with a traditional orgasm are definitely related to ejaculation.
    - Sudden release of 'tension'.
    - Sense of calm, peace and exhaustion.
    - Severe reduction of arousal/interest in porn etc (AKA Refractory period).
    - Actual ejaculation of semen.

    Those are all signs that say "Yes, you've just had an orgasm".

    Also, with traditional masturbation there's a feeling of striving towards an orgasm, and then once you've tried hard enough, you achieve it.
    From a lot of what I've read here though, aneros orgasms don't work that way, and striving towards them tends to just chase them away. Instead you have to just relax and "go with the flow", enjoy the pelasurable sensations until the orgasm comes to you.


    With all these differences, especially the exclusion of some of those "key indicators" of a traditional orgasm and ejaculation combo, I'm left wondering how to define an orgasm when separated from ejaculation.
    How will I know when I have one?


    I expect you'll want to tell me that I'm over-thinking it all, and that orgasms are always self evident such that if you're not sure if you've had one then you haven't, but I just wanted to double check.

    Any comments, tip, suggestions?
  • rumelrumel
    Posts: 2,254
    (Note : Underlined Text is a Hyper-Link)
    Fuzzy,

    I think you have broached a topic with a fairly wide range of possible definitions. I like this discussion I found at Discovery Health, but I don’t think it really addresses prostate based orgasms. While prostate orgasms have been known about for millennia, it is only recently that western culture has begun to explore the possibilities and sensations associated with this form of eroticism. We are members of a growing group of men helping to define these new parameters of what constitutes an orgasm.
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    Thanks for the link, I'll check it out.

    In the time since my first post I read over some of the posts in the My First Super Orgasm... thread, and it seems that for some people, Super-Os can feel the same as a traditional orgasm and ejaculation. So much so that they are surprised to find that there was no ejaculate, and that they don't enter the refractory period afterwards.
    This leads me to believe that I haven't had any prostate orgasms yet in the course of my journey.
    I suspect that I will recognise them when I do get to that point.
  • BusterBuster
    Posts: 953
    Good link Rumel. Too bad they don't go into more detail on man's ability to have multiple orgasms without ejaculation. Now that would be a better read.
  • skeeter_gskeeter_g
    Posts: 240
    Fuzzy,

    Super-Os can feel the same as a traditional orgasm and ejaculation. So much so that they are surprised to find that there was no ejaculate, and that they don't enter the refractory period afterwards.
    This leads me to believe that I haven't had any prostate orgasms yet in the course of my journey.
    I suspect that I will recognise them when I do get to that point.



    I think this recognition is a good start for you. You will know when you have a super orgasm for sure. :wink:
  • thhn
    Posts: 425
    Fuzzy:
    I think you bring up a good topic for discussion. I share your confusion but feel we do need to understand the difference between orgasm and ejaculation
    some of my recent session have brought about the most intense pleasureable feelings and when one of those waves hit me and I feel it is possible an orgasm could be building, I always get a raging hard on. when the feeling subsides, the hard will will go away.
    I have felt this was great progress but could I be building for a hands free orgasm rather than a super O due to the fact that my penis get very arroused?
    I would like to see more discussion about the difference
  • thhn
    Posts: 425
    I would like to keep this thread from settling to the bottom of the pile. I think it has some great unanswered questions
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    I feel like I made some progress in my most recent session and maybe even came very close to having an aneros orgasm.
    The feelings that I experienced were very similar to the aproach of a traditional orgasm. Fast rhythmic contractions in my anus and a sense of expectation in my penis.
    Similar feelings to those at the "point of no return" of a traditional orgasm.
    I'm about to have another session today so hopefully I'll get that far again, or even further.
  • A simple explanation of an orgasm is just think of a woman having an orgasm. Her PC muscle contracts involuntarily while she's having an orgasm (Cumming). That's basically what we're doing. We're experience an orgasm more on terms of what a female experiences. It's a hard concept to understand because we men are so used to ejaculating and calling it an orgasm.

    Just think in terms of a feminine perspective when you're thinking of the word orgasm. It's the easiest thing we can relate to. Go watch all those videos of women masturbating and watch their breathing patterns, tightening/tensing of muscles, pay attention to their whole body through the entire process that leads them to orgasm and through it. Notice how every time when she is having an orgasm her PC muscle is involuntarily contracting.

    That my friends is the same thing we can have. No you're not going to ejaculate or have the regular orgasm you're used to. Yes, you're going to have the sensation that you are ejaculating (Involuntary Control of PC Muscle Contracting) and it may even feel like your going to erupt like Krakatoa! Just imagine building yourself towards Krakatoa. Best part is you can keep building upon building upon building and experiencing multiple orgasms in a session (Multi-Orgasmic).

    You're going to experience something entirely different; something you have never experienced before in your life (I like to call it a full body orgasm). However, once you experience it you'll never forget it and come back for more!!
  • thank you for this nice explanation a ArcticWolves :lol: :lol:
  • Fuzzy said:

    With all these differences, especially the exclusion of some of those "key indicators" of a traditional orgasm and ejaculation combo, I'm left wondering how to define an orgasm when separated from ejaculation.
    How will I know when I have one?



    I would say ANY sensation that feels good is in some way an orgasm, but since our experience with this sort of thing is so limited, all we have to go on is what we feel at the point of ejaculation. I have felt things which at first I wouldn't classify as orgasmic, but looking back on it, I'm certain that that's what they were. Those feelings have grown stronger and stronger and there's no doubt in my mind that anything from pleasant tingles to a knock-your-socks-off full body orgasm qualifies as one.

    Where (or how) do we draw a line between what is orgasmic and what is merely pleasurable? I think it's all the same thing, just felt at differing intensities.
  • BoPBoP
    Posts: 96
    Hey Fuzzy and everyone else!

    Well topic is valid as I always say and one thing I feel is important for people starting out is to understand that orgasms come in endless verity of shapes and forms and levels. Orgasm is often linked to release and release is linked to ejaculation but this is not the case.

    Oftentimes orgasming can feel nothing like what you think it should feel based on your experience. This is why people can be close to amassing multiple orgasm but do not make one step towards it to take it.

    Fuzzy you explained how you get ejaculatory orgasm, well this is one way to approach it approaching full body or multiple orgasm is somewhat different, you can not rely on feelings you already had since they will lead you to ejaculation.

    Try to look for sensations that give pleasure in different ways they often feel numb but if you focus in to them they will begin to expand. Trick here is that non ejaculatory orgasms almost never give you full satisfaction, they can be far more intense than ejaculatory orgasms but will not likely leave you satisfied and released as your normal orgasm will. You will come out of multiple still aroused and ready for more.

    This is important since when you start exploring, these multiple orgasms do happen, when you use aneros and have any kind of pleasurable sensations these are orgasmic feelings; yet many tend to ignore them and since they always leave you aroused in the end you might not focus them as orgasms, you rather say well they are just good feelings, BUT as you keep working they become stronger and people start noticing them thinking they made progress while they could have focused them in the beginning.

    I have been practicing achieving orgasm without physical stimulation form many years and slowly I came to a point where I am able to call the feelings and tune in my body to experience different types of orgasms without doing any stimulation. This is ability anyone can get and it's really amassing to start exploring multiples that way, aneros will although assist you well, it's just important to monitor your feelings and always keep in mind that you should not just lay there and do contractions, be on the lookout for urges to contract other muscles to smile or move these actions will lead you toward an orgasm if you follow them.

    As I explored ejaculation and non ejaculatory orgasms I noted that it is almost not possible to have orgasm that will feel identical to ejaculatory orgasm without ejaculation. Thing is while ejaculation happens there are muscles that contract during dry orgasm no matter how close it feel to the actual thing some of these muscles do not contract, or have much less tension. So ejaculation has it's unique signature.


    Orgasms can feel different from state of extreme tension and sexual joy to deep feelings of well being with nothing sexual in them. I recently faced this type of orgasm it was just pleasure of different level it had no pleasure in the body it was a feeling of "well being here and now" it was extremely deep and emotional and there are no words to describe it but this will give you clear image that orgasms are many.
  • thhn
    Posts: 425
    this is some excellent info provided here - I hope this thread can continue. I am finding this to be most helpful and think I have been making the error to assume an orgasm brought about by the aneros would feel like one brought about by masterbation.
    Perhaps I have been having orgasms all along but not recognizing it. If I am in the middle of a session, relaxed on my back, and a wave comes over me that brings great pleasure, causing me to moan aloud - I should consider this an orgasm?
    I experienced one intense orgasm almost a year ago, very soon into my journey. This orgasm was most intense, definatly as intense as a traditional orgasm, but with no ejactulation. I think this sort of set the bar for me, and I have never been able to get back there. I think that is why I have felt I have never orgasmed since then.
    I think the explanation between these types of orgasms will be most helpful to me

    Guys.... please keep this great info coming
  • Fuzzy,

    I hate to do this to you, but you'll know it when you get it!

    I think that the best advice any of us can give you is, as already stated, keep working at it.

    Second, the more you want it, the less likely you'll be to get it. It's a zen thing, mate.

    Quiet, relaxation and having no particular expectations other than to enjoy whatever comes will lead you sooner than later to achieving the goal. Don't expect too much too soon. It took me weeks.

    You might want to read my latest post: Joy! A Chronicle which describes my journey and my rewards!

    Blessings, Fuzzy. Patience and persistence. Relaxation and the realization that you'll be getting much more than a simple orgasm. You'll be creating self-awareness and tremendous personal power!

    Cockadoodle
  • BusterBuster
    Posts: 953
    Hey Guys,

    For me, this is one of the most important threads out there. There have been several since I started almost 4 years ago, but I believe that with me, understanding EXACTLY what an orgasm is (and isn't) was crucial to my success.

    There are so many good points here from the various members that it is hard to pick out which ones to highlight. What I can tell you is that I got so bogged down in trying to identify/define every little thing that I went through (p-waves, mini-o's, dry-o, p-wave...the list goes on) that I got so caught up in trying to define everything that I was missing what was going on. Once I got my mind around the thought that even the slightest tinge of pleasure was in fact a very small orgasm, I started to make some progress. For example, you have a p-wave and think, "oh, that is just a p-wave" because you have had them before and they did not escalate to a Super O so it must not be all that important. Well, they really are.

    So while there is some great information in this thread, to try and pick out one piece of it is difficult and I would love to see the thread continue and get everyone's feedback. The one that really stood out for me was Justn_Otherguy when he said:


    I would say ANY sensation that feels good is in some way an orgasm

  • BigE
    Posts: 45
    Don't have a lot of time this am so I'll be brief. What I'm feeling as I've learned to separate orgasm from ejaculation is the movement of energy. What I'm experiencing is an opening and a rush of energy from my root. Just throwing it out there as part of the orgasm experience.
  • J4J4
    Posts: 124
    Nice thread. It’s important to discuss the details because words don’t exist that describe what we are experiencing. Apparently defining “orgasm” is like trying to define “rich”.

    I have a tough time distinguishing between a ‘good set of involuntaries’ and ‘dry ejaculatory spasming with not a lot of pleasurable feeling’.

    If a mini-o is just dry ejaculatory spasming with little to mild pleasure, then count me in, I can get there.

    Since starting my journey 6 months ago I’ve had one hands free wet one (during my 1st week! Then no ‘orgasms’ for months), two mini p-waves, 2 hands free exercise ball induced orgasms with ‘some wet clear stuff but no cloudy sticky stuff’ and anywhere from between 0 to 300 mini-o’s. And God help me if I’ve ever had a P-Wave and lacked to the knowledge to know it.

    Therefore, since most of my pleasurable moments hardly fit any description, I’m just always looking to move on from whatever plateau I’m on to the next one. Instead of “The Journey” I feel like I’m on a “Slow Ever Escalating Burn Towards Ignition”.

    I may not be getting any speeding tickets on “The Journey” but the scenery sure is nice.

    I enjoy reading about all our attempts to define what’s happening. You never know, I might wake up tomorrow and decide I’ve been stinking rich all along.

    Keep it up,

    J4
  • BoPBoP
    Posts: 96
    Description of orgasm will always include word pleasure, in fact orgasm means allot of pleasure.

    If you look in to this word you will find that it is for the most part used to define standard orgasms and when people hear it they usually relate to what they had experience with. This is why as you go deeper and new experience comes in like with aneros use people try to give it other names like Super O's and so forth.

    As I mentioned earlier orgasms are related to sexuality and feeling itself is connected to what you experience during sex induced orgasm, but what is sometimes hard to notice is that Orgasm from aneros session can be mind blowing yet will feel completely different from orgasm you get during intercourse. While we call both orgasms are they really the same? Do they deserve to be called the same? You can have orgasms feeling your body in deep relaxation or you can have an orgasm feeling allot of tension why do we call these different experiences same name? They do feel completely different yet that comes from our nature to say: it felt so good without noting what quality it caries.

    Sitting and standing caries distinct signature you sit down and you can feel that you are sitting you stand up and you feel you are standing, you feel it due to distribution of weight, your posture etc. We call these two feelings different things and they are different. When we talk about orgasm same rule applies.

    Orgasm is part of cycle, that cycle is know to all of us since currently medicine keeps sex response model on that cycle. Many people start going for multiple orgasms following same idea, sticking to the same cycle . When you come to this point where you want to experience something that people call Multiple Orgasm, super O or what ever people name it you need to let go of all that crap about how doctors think body responds to sexual stimulation and how orgasms happen.

    There is no cycle, there are no p-waves, k-waves, orgasms or anything else all you experience is pleasure or joy or what ever you call this feeling and all you work with is pleasure and your body.

    Nothing is set in stone your body can give you amassing orgasm for no reason at any time any place and in any position, all the talks about response cycles and needs are bs, this is what limits people in advancing in my opinion and people place limitation on themselves.

    You get pleasure that is important stop calcifying and tagging it take it for what it is.

    Calling all there experiences orgasms is like calling all smells you can smell "SMELLS". Now you go ahead and describe smell of a rose to me in words. Then try to say that smell of a rose is similar to any other smell and that is about what we are doing when we call all these experiences orgasms.
  • J4 said:

    I may not be getting any speeding tickets on “The Journey” but the scenery sure is nice.

    I enjoy reading about all our attempts to define what’s happening. You never know, I might wake up tomorrow and decide I’ve been stinking rich all along.

    Keep it up,

    J4



    That's really the best attitude to have. What's the rush? Everyone is so obsessed with "getting there" that they may be missing some of the sightseeing along the way. If you're feeling good sensations then enjoy them. They will get better.
  • thhn
    Posts: 425
    BoP: I'm not sure I agree exactly with every point you make but you do have a valid argument.
    How can so many people experience different things from aneros use? Aren't we all built pretty much the same?
    I guess it would be like everyone has a different threshold to pain

    I'm probably as guilt as anyone with trying to put a name to the feeling and pin it on a chart to say "here's where I am at"
    I think what has messed me up are the videos on line of guys experiencing Super O's and flopping about as if they are possesed, and thinking that unless this is happening I can't be having a super O

    By the way..... I am jealous of those videos
  • BoPBoP
    Posts: 96
    thhn said:

    BoP: I'm not sure I agree exactly with every point you make but you do have a valid argument.
    How can so many people experience different things from aneros use? Aren't we all built pretty much the same?
    I guess it would be like everyone has a different threshold to pain

    I'm probably as guilt as anyone with trying to put a name to the feeling and pin it on a chart to say "here's where I am at"
    I think what has messed me up are the videos on line of guys experiencing Super O's and flopping about as if they are possesed, and thinking that unless this is happening I can't be having a super O

    By the way..... I am jealous of those videos



    Yes my post is hard going and might push your beliefs and values in general, I ment it that way. I am using word orgasm just like everyone else because it caries a meaning, what i try to stress is for people to stop using it when they have their orgasmic experience and try to understand these feelings without the limits words bring in.

    Experiences can be extremely different considering for example that I am not using aneros to achieve multiple orgasms for some time now.

    I consider videos on this to offer limited insight in to what is actually happening.
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    I think maybe the main idea behind making this topic was to get some reassurance that there is more to be had from the aneros than what I've been getting so far.

    I've had some very nice feelings, various types of involuntary or semi-involuntary contractions, but nothing that has been as intense as a traditional orgasm.
  • I am also waiting to achieve my first prostate orgasm but am confident that when it happens I will know it has. Just think back to your first penile orgasm/ejaculation, for me I was age 13 and despite months of mastubating to no effect I knew the build up and the event itself to that one was different.

    My opinion is that if you are not sure whether you have achieved a mini or super-o then you haven't.
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    [quote=Cracker Jack]I am also waiting to achieve my first prostate orgasm but am confident that when it happens I will know it has. Just think back to your first penile orgasm/ejaculation, for me I was age 13 and despite months of mastubating to no effect I knew the build up and the event itself to that one was different.

    My opinion is that if you are not sure whether you have achieved a mini or super-o then you haven't.
    I don't remember the first time I ejaculated.
    I remember plenty of times in my pre and early teens that I masturbated and had orgasms without ejaculating, I even remember wishing I could ejaculate because I had heard or read about it, but I was a late bloomer and didn't really go through puberty until my mid to late teens.
  • Once I got my mind around the thought that even the slightest tinge of pleasure was in fact a very small orgasm, I started to make some progress . superb splendid writings buster :roll: :roll:
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99

    Once I got my mind around the thought that even the slightest tinge of pleasure was in fact a very small orgasm, I started to make some progress . superb splendid writings buster :roll: :roll:


    I'm not sure I can agree with the idea of even the smallest pleasurable sensations being little orgasms.
    Wouldn't that then mean that traditional masturbation was a series of many small orgasms ending with a big one and ejaculation?
  • BusterBuster
    Posts: 953
    Fuzzy said:

    I'm not sure I can agree with the idea of even the smallest pleasurable sensations being little orgasms.
    Wouldn't that then mean that traditional masturbation was a series of many small orgasms ending with a big one and ejaculation?



    Hi Fuzzy,

    My idea here is that there seems to be too much pressure to identify every little sensation that one experiences. You can get caught up in it. I know that I did. People need to be able to get passed the definition stage and on to the fact that these sensations most times are pleasurable. Some of them don't have pleasure associated with them but they will.

    I actually like your analogy of a traditional masturbation being a series of small orgasms ending with a big one. I agree with that statement except I would take out "and ejaculation" because as we all know, that is the show stopper right there.
  • Love_isLove_is
    Posts: 1,672
    What a fantastic thread guys! :)

    A few nights back, I was experimenting within a session. I was using my Progasm, and laying on my back with my knees bent and legs spread which is a position I almost never use due to not feeling much of any pleasure. I was doing what I thought was voluntary anal contractions that were extremely pleasurable. And ended up bringing myself to a hands free super-T. Which makes me think that in fact I was clenching my PC muscles and didn't realize it because the body position is unfamiliar to me. After orgasming and ejaculating, I found myself wanting more, so I started masturbating my completely soft penis, and eventually had another ejaculatory orgasm. (It surprisingly never did get hard)

    Here's the interesting thing, even though both orgasms were ejaculatory, the hands free super-T was much more intense and better feeling than the orgasm via masturbation. But I found the involuntary anal muscle contractions were completely different during the orgasm. With the hands free super-T, my anal muscles pulsed, making my Progasm move in and out of me in a extremely pleasurable fashion during orgasm. Where as with the masturbatory orgasm, my anal muscles contracted and held hard the Progasm within me which was not pleasurable at all. A very interesting and unintended experiment to experience.

    Now the very next night, my girlfriend and I had sex. And I noticed several times during the course of it, that when I pushed deep in her and held, I would have several orgasmic sensations occurring. I think I was actually having mini, or dry-O's. An incredibly wonderful feeling! I had noticed something like this before in prior sex sessions with my current girlfriend, but having sex the night after an Aneros session really made it much more noticeable and more intense. I liked it! But I found it quite difficult to have a ejaculatory orgasm. It's like because of the Aneros session, my body was tuned into prostrate sensations, not penile ones. I would get close to the point of ejaculation, and my penis head would get too sensitive to continue. So I pulled out and masturbated until I ejaculated on her. And that ejaculatory orgasm wasn't even all that great feeling compared to the mini, or dry-O's I had earlier. Next time I will have to pay more attention to the sensations of mini and dry-O's during sex. :D

    The progress is so varied and interesting during my Aneros journey. I never know or can expect how things will occur. But I'm almost always pleasantly surprised when wonderful sensations do happen.

    Love_is
  • Fuzzy, a great topic you started here. I received my Aneros as a gift before Christmas so am just a newbie. Thanks to this forum after about six sessions I have experienced a whole new world. It seems like I am learning how to speak a new language. Each session I am more relaxed, managing my breathing better, and controlling the convulsions from 30 seconds to 2 minutes. In a typical session I can have upwards of 10 of these before my genitals can't take any more and I always end with ejaculation. At this point my penis and balls feel like they haven't felt for years and I explode and shudder and explode and shutter.

    My own road is similar to everyone else's in preparation but I find it works best for me on my back both knees in a sit-up position and spread the knees far apart. Once the toy is warmed up, I feel both the prostate and perineum and I know I'm there with short and long contractions.

    I agree that this is the female orgasm in the male body which is very cool indeed. I think it will allow me to be a better lover with my lady as I now understand the joy of building these convulsions one after another and not stopping at one when I have rushed to my pleasure before the aneros with my lady.

    My quandry is now how to get my lady to participate as I think having a partner assist is the next level up!
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    I feel like I made some more progress last night.

    I was doing all the things I would normally do in an aneros session but without it in. I've found that nipple stimulation can have some quite powerful effects for me. It often causes involuntary contractions of my abdominal muscles, or makes my hips move by themselves.
    Anyway, I was playing around for a while with my nipples and doing some PC and anal contractions which all felt very nice.
    After about 20 minutes of that I decided to masturbate to ejaculatory orgasm.

    The interesting thing is though, that when I reached the climax, I felt that my orgasm and my ejaculation were not as firmly tied to eachother as they have always been.
    It felt like I reached orgasm a few seconds before ejaculation.
    I suspect that I might have been able to have the orgasm without the ejaculation if I'd decreased or stopped the stimulation of my penis at that time.

    I'm eager to experiment with this a bit more.

    [quote=Napoleon Solo]In a typical session I can have upwards of 10 of these before my genitals can't take any more and I always end with ejaculation.
    Is that ejaculation with or without touching your penis?
    Whatever the case, it seems that you've made excelent progress, especially for only receiving it at Christmas. Who gave it to you?


    [quote=Napoleon Solo]My quandry is now how to get my lady to participate as I think having a partner assist is the next level up!
    Does she know about it at all? If not, that would be the first step.
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    Sorry if it's a sin to double-post, but I have some new musings, and editing my previous post wouldn't bring it back to the first page so people could see it.

    I've tried the nipple play and PC contractions without aneros again a few times, and it's been great.

    Today when finishing off with traditional ejaculatory orgasm I tried leaving my penis alone as soon as I pass the point of no return, and had a really good hands free ejaculation, and when I stroked my penis again after the ejaculation was over it produced an incredible pleasurable feeling for a moment.

    It was sort of like I'd separated the orgasm and ejaculation but in the opisite direction.

    First I had the ejaculation and all the feelings that go with that. PC muscles contracting, feeling the cum pumping out through my penis.

    And then had the orgasm afterwards, which was pretty much just an intense, almost unbearably strong sensation of pleasure through my penis and groin.
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    By the power of the triple post, I use forum necromancy to resurrect this ancient thread of mine!
    Or in other words, I've got new information to share and I thought this old thread was the best place for it.

    It's been months since my last post on this topic, and I've only been continuing my investigations in a fairly haphazard fashion.

    I've been having a few aneros-free sessions in which I do all the stuff I would do in an aneros session, but with no aneros, and they've been good. Almost as good as with the aneros and no preparation or clean-up involved.

    Two main observations to report today.

    1. When I have these aneros-free sessions, they're great, but when I decide to finish with a traditional ejaculatory orgasm I have mixed results. Sometimes I have a really intense and extended ejaculation with orgasm, but other times, I end up with a mediocre ejaculation and minimal or entirely absent orgasm.
    The defining factor seems to be how well I can connect the prostate/nipple pleasure to the penile pleasure.
    If I can get them both running well and synchronised I get wonderful results, but if I get it wrong somehow (And I'm still not sure exactly how), the prostate/nipple pleasure seems to fall away, and the penile pleasure feels sort of dull and heavy.

    2. Following on from the previous observation, I discovered the other night that under some circumstances I can actually continue the prostate/nipple pleasure experience after ejaculating.
    This is how it went:
    I had gone to bed fairly late, and had to get up pretty early in the morning, so I didn't want to spend too much time on my session.
    I spent about half an hour doing prostate/nipple pleasure stuff without the aneros, and it was all very good, but looking at the clock I decided it was really time I got to sleep so that I wouldn't be too tired in the morning.
    I proceeded into traditional masturbation with nipple play included and fairly quickly reached ejaculation, but the accompanying orgasm wasn't much to speak about.
    Feeling a bit cheated by this sub-standard orgasm, I decided to do some more contractions and nipple stimulation and I found that my body was still just as charged and interested in prostate/nipple pleasure as it had been before ejaculating.
    I ended up having a little argument in my head, with one part of me saying "Oooh, look, this is all still active and ready to go", and the other part saying "No, I have to get to sleep, it's so late. If I wait too long the sedative effect of the ejaculation will wear off and I'll have trouble getting to sleep".
    This went on for probably a good ten minutes with me stopping and starting the contractions and nipple play in accordance with the argument.
    Eventually I had to crack down on myself and insist that I must sleep.
  • newbie2009newbie2009
    Posts: 267
    The Discovery Health link in Rumel's post (page #1) rates Gold Nugget status. Quick search in the Wiki didn't identify it.

    This seemed general enough to have broad face value to both men and women, not excluding one or the other. Specific enough to help guys distinguish orgasm from ejaculation. :idea:

    Possibly a "best read" for us heavily wired guys who come here from long-term monogamous relationships. Possibly not as valuable to more loosely wired guys still appreciative of a broader range of experience and sensation.
  • MartyB
    Posts: 80
    [quote=Cracker Jack]I am also waiting to achieve my first prostate orgasm but am confident that when it happens I will know it has. Just think back to your first penile orgasm/ejaculation, for me I was age 13 and despite months of masturbating to no effect I knew the build up and the event itself to that one was different.I do remember, very clearly, my very first orgasm/ejaculation(dry as I was only 7-8 years old). I also remember masturbating before my first orgasm. I remember feeling pleasure, nothing more than "this feels good" pleasure. It was one night that I wasn't very tired, I had a little extra time to enjoy this pleasure. It started out the same; the middle was the same, just as it always was before. Ahhh, there is that nice pleasure that makes me feel oh so good. What made this time different was I did it longer than I had before. I was laying there enjoying the sensations of pleasure when something different started happening. It felt great so I continued. Interestingly, I continued at the same pace and vigor as I always had up to that point and in the past. I had no expectations; I didn't know anything else was going to happen. The pleasure increased as something built and built. I went through all of the motions (100% to the T) of a traditional orgasm/ejaculation (without any fluid obviously) and the pleasure weaned off just as it does today. I have my doubts about being able to have multiple orgasms in this way just because there isn't any fluid release. I don't feel that made any difference at all.

    I remember feeling so incredibly excited and happy with my new discovery, I must have glowed for days. A few days later, I remember thinking no matter what happens (in general), nothing will get me down or feeling sad because of ....hmmm, what was that again? I forgot what it was! That incredible thing that just happened in my life. I don't have a clue what it is, but I know nothing will get me feeling down ever again. Now what was that.... oh yea, I remember, it was that :)

    To this day, it makes me happy that I remember my first orgasm/ejac(pre) along with my thoughts and feelings with a pure and innocent mind. It wasn't until later in life (enter religion) that my mind was tainted about this wonderful gift. Although that didn't stop me, it just made me feel guilty about it.


    [quote=Cracker Jack]My opinion is that if you are not sure whether you have achieved a mini or super-o then you haven't. I’m not so sure about this. After some much needed guidance from rumel in chat, reading this thread, and reflecting on what I've experienced; I think I have seen the top of a mountain or two. There are many mountain tops to be seen, I guess I wasn't impressed enough with what I saw and told myself this isn't a mountain.


    Fuzzy, have you discovered the difference between orgasm and ejaculation to satisfaction in your mind?

    Enjoy the journey,
    Marty
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    MartyB said:

    Fuzzy, have you discovered the difference between orgasm and ejaculation to satisfaction in your mind?

    Enjoy the journey,
    Marty



    I'm still not entirely satisfied. I think I'll need to keep investigating until I experience orgasm without ejaculation at all. That is, assuming I can identify it when I do.

    Reading back over the posts in this topic, I noticed ArticWolves' post on the first page.

    A simple explanation of an orgasm is just think of a woman having an orgasm. Her PC muscle contracts involuntarily while she's having an orgasm (Cumming). That's basically what we're doing. We're experience an orgasm more on terms of what a female experiences. It's a hard concept to understand because we men are so used to ejaculating and calling it an orgasm.

    Just think in terms of a feminine perspective when you're thinking of the word orgasm. It's the easiest thing we can relate to. Go watch all those videos of women masturbating and watch their breathing patterns, tightening/tensing of muscles, pay attention to their whole body through the entire process that leads them to orgasm and through it. Notice how every time when she is having an orgasm her PC muscle is involuntarily contracting.

    That my friends is the same thing we can have. No you're not going to ejaculate or have the regular orgasm you're used to. Yes, you're going to have the sensation that you are ejaculating (Involuntary Control of PC Muscle Contracting) and it may even feel like your going to erupt like Krakatoa! Just imagine building yourself towards Krakatoa. Best part is you can keep building upon building upon building and experiencing multiple orgasms in a session (Multi-Orgasmic).

    You're going to experience something entirely different; something you have never experienced before in your life (I like to call it a full body orgasm). However, once you experience it you'll never forget it and come back for more!!



    With that in mind, and the ideas from Pan's Fantasy Method thread, I had another session last night and I think I got very close to it a couple of times.

    I had feelings of warmth and tingling in my anal region accompanied by some gentle involuntary pulsing or contractions. As these continued I reached a point where I felt a special twinge in my urethra like the point of no return when about to ejaculate, but as soon as I noticed it, it disappeared and the other sensations receded somewhat.

    My guess is that I was right on the edge there, but by noticing the feeling and paying attention to it I scared it away.
    Any advice on what to do at that point? Relax everything as much as possible? Make a contraction with a certain muscle?
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,476
    Fuzzy this is great thread! And all you other posters as well!

    As to your questions immediately above about your recent "almost" session, IMHO you are at a great juncture in your rewiring. We have several nerve systems that can carry erotic arousal and orgasmic responses. For many, part of this rewiring involves shifting more emphasis to the vagus nerve system, a wandering abdomenal back road network compared to the pudendal expressway to the standard destination...

    Your "noticing", "paying (too much?) attention", "scaring it away" analysis is a direct parallel to the metaphor at KSMO of these pure orgasmic energies being like a faun timidly stepping into a clearing and the key thing is to quietly observe without consciously approaching them and scaring them away. Your thoughts on this juncture for your rewiring are very astute.

    We are all different, butt that said, I would suggest when you get to that point again, try relaxing, yes, taking a deep breath and as you exhale intend and feel throughout your body a sense of opening up, of welcoming space for those energies to expand possibly into your perineum, anus, prostate, sacrum and wherever they want to go (have no expectations) just relaxing and allowing them to flower wherever in you they choose...

    Visualizing your own internal opening up can be the key, again, letting your body do it, without the mind going there to watch/take charge.

    all the best through this juncture of your journey you would-be wanderer! :D

    artform
  • rainstomp
    Posts: 51
    Thanks for bringing this thread back up!
  • MartyB
    Posts: 80
    Fuzzy said:

    I'm still not entirely satisfied. I think I'll need to keep investigating until I experience orgasm without ejaculation at all. That is, assuming I can identify it when I do.

    :?: In your heart, do you believe they are two different events?

    Identifying orgasm is something you can already do through a T-orgasm. The trick is to take your time so each event unfolds slowly. With the extra time to experience and explore these events you can separate them out easier. I'm not suggesting the get close and stop over and over method. I suggest going slow at consistent pace for an extended time.

    :?: Have you ever thought to yourself, "I can't believe I'm not cumming! (Ejaculating)," during an extended traditional masturbation session? I suggest "extended" would be 20-30 minutes minimum and 50-90 minutes max (you can go longer, but it doesn't seem to help) as a time frame for this.

    What made me say this to myself was I was well past the point of no return for twice as long as I had ever been. I was waiting for the ejaculation reflex to start and it just held out. It blew my mind! It was this exact moment I knew in my heart, orgasm was not the same as ejaculation. I no longer believed everything I felt up to that point, had anything to do with ejaculation (although the pump was priming or building). The reflexive pumping action of ejaculation was held off long enough for it to click in my mind.

    When the ejaculation reflex did start the pleasure did spike, but was almost too much from where I just was, comfortably well past the point of no return before ejac began. It was the extra time I spent here that opened my eyes. I thought if I could get 10-15 seconds of this I would never need to have a traditional orgasm again! The moment I'm talking about lasts a half a second, if that, when I'm rushing or going at a fair/normal rate. If I slow down, take my time and get into it, this moment can last 1-2 seconds. These are usually the vocal, spine tingling, "Oh yea, that was a good one" traditional male orgasm and ejaculation. I held on to this moment for 3-4 seconds when my eyes were opened.

    Practicing this method goes completely against one commandment laid down for the aneros. That is, if you are not chasing and hunting down your T-orgasm, you're not doing it correctly. If the level of stimulation (alone) you are feeling is enough to get you to t-orgasm, that level is too much, slow it down. It helps to have a bullet vibrator with an elastic band of some type to keep everything in place and keep the level of stimulation constant. Don't worry about going limp, the mind is still aroused. Queue up a few hours of porn and make a night of it.

    :!: Again what I'm suggesting is only for those who deep down in their hearts are having trouble believing orgasm and ejaculation are different, or for those that need an experience to that effect.

    Enjoy the Journey,
    Marty
  • Fuzzy
    Posts: 99
    Thanks for the advice there Marty.
    I've had similar experiences to what you describe.


    Years ago, before I knew anything about the Aneros, I did some investigation into male multiple orgasm, continuous male orgasm and so on, and found out about a technique that advised training up the PC muscle to be able to clench and hold at the point of orgasm to stop or delay ejaculation.
    I practiced my kegels quite a lot after that, and got into the habit of clamping up my PC muscle at the point of orgasm.

    I found that it did work to some degree.

    I could reach orgasm and then delay the ejaculation for as long as I could keep the PC muscle clenched.
    It became a routine part of my masturbatory technique and I still do it a lot even now.

    For a time it was what I did every time, but then I found some advice somewhere about doing basically the opposite. Relaxing that muscle, and sort of pushing out with other muscles.
    That didn't have any delaying effect on ejaculation and resulted in a significantly different feeling.

    These days I do one or the other as the mood takes me.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,476
    Hey MartyB and Fuzzy

    Interesting post Marty and your experiences Fuzzy. In the early 1990s I spent about a year and half or more applying Mantak Chia's Taoist techniques for male sexual energy cultivation. That is based on semen retention and developing the ability to ejaculate inwardly, backward into the uro-genital tracts.

    I still slip into that response very occasionally if I slip toward a Super-T before really intending to. Similarly, mrs. a on occasion finds her female ejaculation flows inward and then expelled later mixed with some urine. When it expels directly out during her usual ejaculation, it is most definitely NOT urine, but the flowing waters of the goddess! :D

    Even after we successfully rewire to the separation of orgasm from ejaculation, the set of other alternate and original "switches" remain and, though diminished, can still be triggered by chance or by choice. :wink:

    all the best Fuzzy with your rewiring through this stage

    artform
  • Billy11
    Posts: 280
    artform wrote

    That is based on semen retention and developing the ability to ejaculate inwardly, backward into the uro-genital tracts.



    Interesting artform. Any way to explain the technique you used to do this? I spent many years of my life masterbating a certain way that made it to where I would have the most intense orgasm/inward ejaculations ever (well until I learned to super O) and I could cum but no semen would come out.

    Not going to go into detail right now of how I did it but it was to the point that I used this form of masterbation for nearly a decade and rarely masterbated the traditional jacking off motion except to release semen because I felt I may be damaging myself masterbating the other way. But my other way of masterbation produces an orgasm/inward ejaculation that's probably 10X stronger than a traditional ejaculation produces.

    Anyway very curious of what you did to have these inward ejaculations.
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,476
    Billy11 said:

    artform wrote

    That is based on semen retention and developing the ability to ejaculate inwardly, backward into the uro-genital tracts.



    Interesting artform. Any way to explain the technique you used to do this? I spent many years of my life masterbating a certain way that made it to where I would have the most intense orgasm/inward ejaculations ever (well until I learned to super O) and I could cum but no semen would come out.

    Not going to go into detail right now of how I did it but it was to the point that I used this form of masterbation for nearly a decade and rarely masterbated the traditional jacking off motion except to release semen because I felt I may be damaging myself masterbating the other way. But my other way of masterbation produces an orgasm/inward ejaculation that's probably 10X stronger than a traditional ejaculation produces.

    Anyway very curious of what you did to have these inward ejaculations.


    OK Billy11, I'll explain mine if you'll explain yours! :lol:

    Mantak Chia's book Taoist Secrets of Love: Cultivating Male Sexual Energy is focused on controlling the emission of semen to minimize semen loss in solo sex and lovemaking, to have semen retained to be transmuted into Chi the healing life force energies, and to enable the male the achieve the Microcosmic Orbit of these energies up the spine through all the chakras and back down the central organs to accumulate for added later power in the lower abdomen.

    Two methods are set out:
    1. three fingers carefully clamping the urethra up through the perineum (don't attempt this without reading all the cautions and suggestions in Chia's book!); and
    2. a full body clench focused on the same area to learn to be able the have the focused muscle strength to accomplish the same blocking of the urethra without the direct fingers pressure. Again, his book gives all the details of what muscles, related breathing patterns etc. Chia also has a more recent book The MultiOrgasmic Man, which I haven't seen, although we have his The MultiOrgasmic Couple, which I do recommend highly.

    I began with the fingers, felt uncomfortable and concerned about bruising or worse injury and moved on to the focused full body clench and that worked for me. I talked a bit more about this and achieving the MCO (microcosmic orbit) in my blog: http://www.aneros.com/displayblog.php?id=3544

    The more I read elsewhere, the more I got into what is now shaping up as a challenge from western science of Taoist assumptions, that ejaculation ("clearing the pipes" and the prostate in particular!) is an important positive health strategy.

    My concern then was that each sperm we produce contains, along with our DNA package for delivery, a powerful chemical to dissolve the cell wall of the egg at the point of contact to enable the DNA delivery to be accomplished. Now our testicles and other parts like the seminal vesicles seem to be designed to cope with it, but I thought is it a good idea to force sperm in quantity into body parts where they are not expected (bladder etc.) where they are die and dissolve with this cell wall dissolving chemical being released? Perhaps too much of this is a factor in testicular or prostate cancer formation!?? Ergo, keep things cleared out! :D That, and a very strong body sense that "I WANT to let it out!" led me to abandoning retention as a preferred practice.

    As I have celebrated widely here and at KSMO and The Tao Bums, Aneros and KSMO ( www.multiples.com ), Aneros and KSMO have fully enabled me to achieve, without retention!, the energies transformations, the MCO, and now MUTUAL MCO and more with mrs. a!!!, while at the same time successfully treating my BPH prostate problem in a healthy "clear the pipes" way! Hurray! :D

    OK Billy11, you're up! :wink:

    all the best

    artform
  • newbie2009newbie2009
    Posts: 267
    Those of us who shoot blanks retain sperm. I've been doing it for >35yrs. Mine are all dumped into the interior of the scrotum (which was never designed to deal with stray sperm). Probably, not to worry.

    Now, let me tell you about the third ear I've been growing. :evil: :roll: :o :shock:
  • artformartform
    Posts: 1,476
    Very interesting NuBe09.

    Do you have any sensations from this in/at your scrotum? Any sense of reabsorption or energizing?

    I have a photo of the genetically modified lab mice growing growing replacement human ears (the pinna). So, you're in this business too? :lol:

    Thanks for this.

    artform
  • Fuzzy said:


    Years ago, before I knew anything about the Aneros, I did some investigation into male multiple orgasm, continuous male orgasm and so on, and found out about a technique that advised training up the PC muscle to be able to clench and hold at the point of orgasm to stop or delay ejaculation.
    I practiced my kegels quite a lot after that, and got into the habit of clamping up my PC muscle at the point of orgasm.

    I found that it did work to some degree.

    I could reach orgasm and then delay the ejaculation for as long as I could keep the PC muscle clenched.
    It became a routine part of my masturbatory technique and I still do it a lot even now.

    For a time it was what I did every time, but then I found some advice somewhere about doing basically the opposite. Relaxing that muscle, and sort of pushing out with other muscles.
    That didn't have any delaying effect on ejaculation and resulted in a significantly different feeling.

    These days I do one or the other as the mood takes me.



    I went through much the same process, using clenching to hold back ejaculation, and it does help to extend pleasure, but there are times when I just couldn't hold back. But then I discovered relaxing and pushing out, almost as if you were tying to urinate, could help lessen the refractory period for me. For a few years, I worked around the corner from a gentleman's club, and spent far too many lunch hours getting lap dances. By pushing out at the point of no return, my ejaculate would stream out rather than spurt, and I found that if I could hold that "pushing out" feeling through my ejaculation, I would often stay erect and be able to orgasm again within minutes. The first time I tried this technique with lap dances, my first ejaculate/stream wet my pants and the dancer acknowledged and backed off for the rest of the song. But before the song ended, I knew I wanted her to continue and asked her not to stop. I was still hard and was able to shift my "package" to the other side of my pants. She continued dancing and my energy level was like I hadn't already cum. I knew she would bring me over the top again and within 6-7 minutes, I came again -- I wasn't able to relax through it and had a normal ejaculatory orgasm. She was surprised as she now felt the wet spot on the other side of my pants, and all within a few minutes. Needless to say, I visited her fairly often after that.

    I'm a newbie with the Aneros and have only tried a few sessions. So far, I haven't gone over the edge into Super-O but I'm starting to feel that it's getting closer. I'm trying different relax/contract feelings and have had a couple of hands-free orgasms, so far, without my penis being very hard. I hope I on the right path.
  • newbie2009newbie2009
    Posts: 267
    artform said:

    Very interesting NuBe09.

    Do you have any sensations from this in/at your scrotum? Any sense of reabsorption or energizing?

    artform



    None, either physical or psychological. Just the joy and thrill of having exactly the size of family that I desired and no fears of putting one in the hangar.

    The old wives tales look like b.s. to me. I'm right in the middle of all the bell shaped curves that pertain to male sexuality. ...sickenly average.